1862 1 IN THE CIRCUIT COURT OF THE NINTH JUDICIAL CIRCUIT IN AND 2 FOR ORANGE COUNTY, FLORIDA 3 LAWRENCE M. DESTEFANO, 4 Plaintiff, 5 vs. CASE NO.: CI-00-7265 DIVISION: 32 6 ADVENTIST HEALTH SYSTEM SUNBELT HEALTHCARE 7 CORPORATION; ADVENTIST HEALTH SYSTEM/SUNBELT, INC.; SUNBELT 8 HEALTH CARE CENTERS, INC.; ROLLINS BEDFORD CORPORATION, 9 d/b/a SUNBELT HEALTHCARE & SUBACUTE CENTER; SHCC 10 SERVICES, INC., and ORLANDO REGIONAL HEALTHCARE SYSTEM, 11 INC., 12 Defendants. 13 ------------------------------------------------------ 14 VOLUME XIV 15 (Pages 1862 through 1992) 16 Continued transcript of proceedings held before the 17 Honorable Renee Roche, Judge of the Circuit Court, Orange 18 County, Florida, on Tuesday, October 25, 2005, beginning 19 at 8:51 a.m., at the Orange County Courthouse, Orlando, 20 Florida, before Laura J. Landerman, R.M.R., C.R.R., and 21 Notary Public, State of Florida at Large. 22 23 24 25 1863 1 A P P E A R A N C E S: 2 WILLIAM G. OSBORNE, ESQUIRE TERRY McCULLOUGH, Legal Assistant 3 Law Offices of William G. Osborne, P.A. 538 East Washington Street 4 Orlando, Florida 32801 and 5 BRADLEY CONWAY, ESQUIRE 390 North Orange Avenue 6 Orlando, Florida 32801 7 For the Plaintiffs, 8 TRACY A. MARSHALL, ESQUIRE DYANA L. PETRO, ESQUIRE 9 Gray Robinson 301 East Pine Street -- Suite 1400 10 Orlando, Florida 32801 11 For the Defendant, Adventist Health System, 12 LARRY J. TOWNSEND, ESQUIRE 13 DAVID EVANS, ESQUIRE Mateer & Harbert 14 Landmark Center II -- Suite 600 225 East Robinson Street 15 Orlando, Florida 32801 16 For the Defendant, Orlando Regional Healthcare System, Inc., 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 1864 1 I N D E X 2 TESTIMONY OF LAWRENCE M. DESTEFANO 3 Direct Examination by Mr. Osborne 1865 Cross-Examination by Ms. Marshall 1972 4 5 E X H I B I T S (In Evidence) 6 Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 23 1954 Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 24 1960 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 1865 1 (Continued from Volume XIII) 2 - - - - - 3 MR. OSBORNE: Plaintiff calls Larry Destefano. 4 LAWRENCE M. DESTEFANO 5 having been first duly sworn testified as follows: 6 DIRECT EXAMINATION 7 BY MR. OSBORNE: 8 Q State your full name for the court and the 9 jury, please. 10 A Lawrence Michael Destefano. 11 Q Where do you presently reside? 12 A I reside with my girlfriend, Kay McNeill. 13 Q And what part of town does she live in? 14 A She lives in College Park. 15 Q Tell the jury where you were born and what 16 your upbringing was in your early years. 17 A My mother was Cuban. She was born in Havana, 18 Cuba. That was in 1960. Batista was still in office. 19 When Castro took over, we had to immigrate to the United 20 States. My father was a U.S. citizen, so we were allowed 21 to immigrate. 22 Q What was your father's name? 23 A Howard Schwarz. 24 Q What year was it that you immigrated to the 25 United States? 1866 1 A 1961, I think. 2 Q And where did you go live? 3 A We went to live in New York City. 4 Q Tell the jury what your mother did after she 5 came to the United States. 6 A When she came to the United States, she went 7 to work for Bulova Watch Company in Rockefeller Center as 8 an executive secretary. 9 Q And you have one brother? 10 A I have one brother. 11 Q What's his name? 12 A Joseph Schwarz. 13 Q How much older is he than you? 14 A Joseph Destefano. I'm sorry. He's one and a 15 half years older. 16 Q So you moved to New York, and did your parents 17 stay together? 18 A No, they divorced after about two and a half 19 years, three years. 20 Q So what did your mother do then after she 21 divorced Mr. Schwarz? 22 A She worked for Bulova Watch Company, and she 23 raised both of us. 24 Q Okay. As a sole parent? 25 A Yes, she did. 1867 1 Q And during the time -- how old were you during 2 those years in New York when she was single and you and 3 your brother were there? 4 A We got there when I was one. She was divorced 5 after about three years. I was three years old, and she 6 raised us till I was about ten or eleven years old. 7 Q Was your mother an attractive woman? 8 A Yes, I would say so. 9 Q And during the time that she was raising you 10 by herself, did she have suitors that would come and want 11 to go out with her? 12 A Yes. There were -- there were many times on 13 Friday, Saturday evenings when she got off work and we'd 14 get home, she'd get phone calls or coworkers, male 15 coworkers would knock on her door. She didn't go out 16 with them. She said she couldn't go out because she had 17 to take care of us. 18 Q Was it that way pretty much succinctly during 19 the time you lived in New York? 20 A Pretty much, yes. 21 Q She would work at Bulova during the daytime 22 and take care of you kids on nights and weekends? 23 A We stayed together, yes. We were a tight 24 family. 25 Q What happened when you were ten or eleven in 1868 1 terms of New York City and what you were doing? 2 A My mother met a gentleman named Ralph 3 Destefano. He started an import/export business, and 4 then from there we went -- we moved overseas to 5 Micronesia. And then I lived in Japan, and we were gone 6 for about 20 years overseas. 7 Q How old were you when you moved to Micronesia? 8 A About 11, 12 years old. 9 Q And who is Mr. Destefano? 10 A Mr. Destefano was my mother's second husband. 11 They married. 12 Q And how old were you when they got married? 13 A I'd say about 10 or 11. I'm not sure. 14 Q Where did you go in Micronesia? 15 A We first went to Guam, and then we traveled 16 extensively through Micronesia, Taneup, Rota, Saipan, 17 took trips in the Far East. 18 Q So would you agree with me that your formative 19 years were spent in the Far East, Micronesia? 20 A I spent 20 years in the Far East before I came 21 back to the United States. 22 Q Do you speak Japanese? 23 A I've lost a lot of it, but I think I can 24 communicate a little bit now still. 25 Q And what did your mother do when you were in 1869 1 Guam? 2 A My mother, while she was married to Ralph 3 Destefano, she went back to get her education and got her 4 bachelor's, and I'm not sure if she got her master's. 5 Q And at some point in time, did your mother and 6 Mr. Destefano divorce? 7 A Yes. They divorced -- it wasn't a very good 8 marriage, and they divorced -- I don't know when they 9 divorced, but they had separated fairly shortly after the 10 marriage, after three years, two, three years. 11 Q So is this when you were in Guam? 12 A Yes. 13 Q And who raised you after Mr. Destefano left 14 the picture? 15 A My mother did. 16 Q And what was she doing for a living after she 17 had her education? 18 A After she got her degree, then she got a job 19 as a -- she became a professor at a community college, 20 and she taught business administration at Guam Community 21 College. 22 Q How was school for you back in those days, 23 back in Guam? 24 A School for me personally? 25 Q Correct, for you personally. 1870 1 A I didn't go to school. 2 Q Who taught you? 3 A My mother did. She home schooled me. 4 Q And why didn't you go to school? 5 A I didn't want to go to school. 6 Q Okay. And let me ask you a little bit about 7 your growing up, your formative years from age 11 or so 8 until 17. Were you in Guam during that period of time? 9 A I'm sorry. Again, Mr. -- 10 Q Age 11 to 17, is that where you were living, 11 in Guam? 12 A Yes. 13 Q And tell the jury, if you would, what effect, 14 in your mind, growing up in that culture had on who you 15 are today as a person. 16 A Growing up overseas, spending a lot of time in 17 Micronesia, spending a lot of time in Japan, there is a 18 very great emphasis on honor and dignity and just keeping 19 your word. And I think it's the same here as well, but 20 it's -- 21 Q Okay. During the years you were with your 22 mother from the beginning till 17, what was your 23 relationship like with your mother? 24 A It was very, very close. 25 Q And what happened when you were 17 in terms of 1871 1 how your life changed or the direction that you took? 2 A I joined the United States Navy. I spent 3 three years in the Navy. 4 Q And what was your general experience in the 5 Navy? What types of things did you do in the Navy? 6 A I was -- I joined as an E-1. I was a 7 boatson's mate and I was a helmsman. We had general 8 quarters, assigned duties that we had to do. 9 Q And after you got out of the Navy -- let me 10 ask you this. After you got out of the Navy, did you 11 stay in the Far East? 12 A Yes. I went back -- I went back overseas. 13 Q And where did you go? 14 A I got a job in Guam. I worked for different 15 companies and then I was transferred to Japan. 16 Q How long did you live in Japan? 17 A I would say about five, six, maybe seven 18 years. 19 Q What type work did you do in Japan? 20 A I was what was called a manufacturer broker 21 representative. We represent -- instead of each company 22 from the U.S. sending a corporate representative 23 overseas, what they do is they -- is they hire one 24 company that will represent different manufacturers 25 overseas, and it's cheaper for the companies. So I would 1872 1 have different products that I would represent like R.J. 2 Reynolds Tobacco, Nabisco, General Mills. 3 Q And when you -- 4 A And we would represent those accounts in the 5 Far East. 6 Q When you were in Japan, did you meet and 7 marry -- meet a girl and marry? 8 A I actually met her in Guam. 9 Q And who is that? 10 A That was Mieko. 11 Q And when did you and Mieko marry? 12 A When I was 21, maybe 22. 13 Q Did you have any children? 14 A No children, no. 15 Q Did there come a point in time where you and 16 Mieko moved to the United States? 17 A Yes. 18 Q Where did you move to? 19 A We moved to Hallendale, Florida. 20 Q What brought you to Florida? 21 A My mother. 22 Q That was where she was living? 23 A She was living in Florida, yes. 24 Q How old were you when you came back to Florida 25 to the United States? 1873 1 A Don't hold me to this, Mr. Osborne. I'd say 2 about 30 years old, 32. 3 Q What was your mother doing at that time? 4 A She was retired. 5 Q Did she have a condominium or a house -- 6 A She had a house. She owned a house. 7 Q And did you move somewhere close to your 8 mother? 9 A Yes, we did. 10 Q What was your relationship like with your 11 mother after you moved back to the United States? 12 A I was very excited to see my mother. I hadn't 13 seen her in a number of years. Working overseas, when I 14 came back, the first few days I had stayed with her, 15 she -- it was good, but there were some strange parts 16 that I didn't understand. She had accused me of stealing 17 her money, stealing her keys. She accused me of hiding 18 things. 19 Q Was that out of character for your mother? 20 A Yes. 21 Q Did you know anything about Alzheimer's at the 22 time that those events were occurring? 23 A No, I didn't. 24 Q Do you now know that those symptoms are early 25 signs of Alzheimer's? 1874 1 A Yes, I do. 2 Q What was your reaction at the time given what 3 was going on? 4 A I was angry at her. I was surprised. I 5 remember arguing with her and asking her why would she 6 accuse me of these things. She never accused me before. 7 I never -- never did those things before. 8 Q What happened as a result of that? 9 A My mother and I, we would have fights, I 10 remember, prior to that, just like any normal spats. And 11 if I was wrong, I would -- after a few days, I would call 12 her and apologize. And if she was wrong, she would call 13 me and apologize. But there would be a, you know, there 14 would be a couple of weeks where we wouldn't speak until 15 someone called, and it would be all okay again. 16 Q What happened this time? 17 A She didn't call me. She didn't -- I was 18 waiting for her phone call, and she -- I don't know. I 19 was wrong. I just didn't know -- I didn't know what was 20 going on. I didn't call her -- I didn't call her back. 21 I was very upset by being accused. 22 Q When was the next time you heard from your 23 mother or about your mother after that? 24 A We still -- we saw each other. I would -- we 25 went out to dinner a couple of times, Mieko and I, and 1875 1 I'd ask my mother why she cussed at me or why she accused 2 me of stealing her money. And she would tell me -- she 3 would act like -- well, she didn't remember. But at the 4 time I thought she was acting like she didn't remember 5 accusing me of these things, and it would make me angry, 6 and -- 7 Q At some point in time, did your mother move to 8 Arizona? 9 A Yes, she did. 10 Q When was that? 11 A She called me, and she wanted to go out. We 12 went out to a Japanese restaurant, and she told me she 13 was moving to Arizona with my brother. And I asked her, 14 why? Why do you want to move to Arizona? And it was -- 15 it was a very strange dinner because I remember when I 16 was talking to her, we would make eye contact, and then 17 she would just stare passed me while we were talking. 18 And it was a very disconnected conversation, and I was 19 trying to talk her out of moving to Arizona, but she said 20 she was moving. 21 Q Again, do you know now that what you were 22 witnessing was early stage Alzheimer's? 23 A Now I know that, yes. 24 Q Did you have any clue at the time that your 25 mother was beginning to suffer from Alzheimer's disease? 1876 1 A No, that was my fault. I didn't. 2 Q When did you first learn that your mother had 3 some difficulty in Arizona? 4 A Susan Hernandez, the mother of my child down 5 in Miami, kept in contact with my mother, and they stayed 6 in contact all the time. And Susan Hernandez called me 7 and said she was worried about my mother. And I asked 8 her why, and she said she wasn't answering the phone. 9 All she was getting was the answering machine for about 10 two weeks. 11 So after I hung up, I called up the Tempe 12 Police Department in Arizona where she was living, and I 13 asked them if they knew anything about Carolina 14 Destefano. I gave the Tempe police my mother's address 15 and asked them to please go out there and find out what 16 was going on. 17 Q Let me ask you to back up a second. Susan 18 Hernandez is the mother of your child? 19 A Yes. 20 Q How old is your child? 21 A Shawn is nine years old now. 22 Q Okay. And did Susan Hernandez and your son 23 have a relationship with your mother? 24 A Yes. 25 Q And is that why Susan was checking on your 1877 1 mother to see how she was doing? 2 A Yes. 3 Q So what'd you find out next? 4 A The Tempe Police Department called me back in 5 a couple -- in about two hours, and they told me she was 6 at the Maricopa psychiatric ward. 7 Q What'd you do then? Well, let me back up a 8 little bit, and let's get some background. 9 What year is this we're talking about right 10 now, month and year? 11 A This would be either December -- this would be 12 either December of '98 or January of 1999. 13 Q Let me get some other background information. 14 Did you and Mieko at some point in time divorce? 15 A Yes. 16 Q When was that? 17 A I'd say back up about eight years, nine years 18 now. 19 Q Was that an amicable divorce? 20 A Yes, of course. 21 Q You and Mieko are still friends today? 22 A We're very, very close, very close. 23 Q So what happened after you learned about this, 24 about your mother? Hang on a second. 25 What were you doing? What was your business 1878 1 at the time that you heard your mother was having 2 difficulty in Arizona? 3 A I owned an antique restoration center. It was 4 called Elegant Interior Antiques. 5 Q Where was that located? 6 A That was located on North Rio Grande right on 7 Princeton as you get to OBT. There's a 7-Eleven there. 8 You make a left, and that's North Rio Grand. There is a 9 warehouse. 10 Q And what was the nature of your business? 11 What'd you do? 12 A Restored antique furniture for clients who had 13 sentimental furniture, expensive furniture. We also 14 worked with the museum downtown, restored their pieces 15 when they were damaged, and we also built some custom 16 furniture. 17 Q When you say "we," who are you talking about 18 as far as we? 19 A Myself, I had a partner named Jim Davis, and 20 we had about six or seven employees, maybe ten or eleven 21 when it got real busy. 22 Q So what did you do after you heard that your 23 mother was in a psychiatric hospital in Arizona? 24 A Called the employees that were working with me 25 at the time. I told them I had to shut down my business. 1879 1 I don't know if Jim Davis was still with me or if he had 2 moved on, but basically I shut down my business. I 3 called up the Maricopa -- you want me to continue? 4 Q Go ahead, yeah. 5 A I called up the Maricopa County psychiatric 6 ward to find out if my mother was there. They said she 7 was there. I said I was her son, and I was going to be 8 out there immediately. They said okay. I called up the 9 airlines. They told -- they told me the ticket would 10 be -- to get out that evening, they told me the ticket 11 would be about, I think, it was 2500 dollars. 12 I called back over to Maricopa County. I said 13 I need a little time to get that kind of money or I could 14 get a ticket in about six or seven days for about 200 15 dollars. And the nurse assured me, she said, 16 Mr. Destefano, your mother's being very well taken care 17 of. She's been here for about, I don't know, if it was 18 three weeks, and she said you could either come out now 19 or it would make no difference if you came out in six 20 days and saved the 2,000 dollars and got your ticket 21 because you gave them advanced notice. And so I made the 22 choice to wait a week and get all my affairs in order and 23 take advantage of the discount on the ticket. 24 Q What'd you do with your business during the 25 time that you were gone? 1880 1 A I shut it down. 2 Q And then when you went out there, what was 3 your mother's condition? 4 A She was -- she was very confused. She was -- 5 she was demented. I never saw her that way. She was 6 just confused. But she knew who I was. When I got to 7 the door, she said, ello, enso, so she knew who I was. 8 Q And -- 9 A She saw me through the window of the 10 psychiatric ward. 11 Q And what was your understanding as to the 12 stage of Alzheimer's she was in by the time you got out 13 to Arizona? 14 A She was in latter -- they call it latter 15 stages of Alzheimer's or end-stage Alzheimer's. 16 Q What did you do after you found your mother in 17 the psychiatric ward? Where did you take her? 18 A From there -- she spent another week there. I 19 came to visit her every day when visiting hours started 20 and when it ended. And then I think it was a week later 21 I regained custody of my mother because she was made a 22 ward of the State, and then I brought her back to the 23 house. 24 Q Is that like a Baker Act here in Florida? 25 A Exactly. 1881 1 Q And at some point in time, did you become her 2 power of attorney? 3 A Yes, I did. 4 Q And did you have a do not resuscitate as well? 5 A My mother did. I mean, my mother -- we went 6 to the attorney, and we sat -- she was -- she was 7 confused, and they said she was in the latter stages of 8 Alzheimer's, but when we sat down, she could still -- 9 there was that window where she still understood what was 10 going on and what was happening. 11 And we sat for many hours with Mr. Elseworth, 12 who was the attorney, and we -- and I always knew that my 13 mother never wanted to be kept alive artificially or she 14 didn't want intravenous lines or anything like that, and 15 that was all written up after they had sat her down and 16 spoke to her. I guess that's where the do not 17 resuscitate came from. 18 Q Okay. And how did you know that your mother 19 never wanted to have tubes or any type of artificial 20 means of maintaining her existence? 21 A She always made that -- we always spoke about 22 that growing up. She always told me she didn't want to 23 be hooked up. That wasn't the way she wanted to go. 24 Q Where did you take your mother after she was 25 discharged from the hospital in your care? 1882 1 A I took her back -- I took her back to her 2 house. 3 Q Okay. And where was that? 4 A In Tempe, Arizona. It was about a half hour, 5 40 minutes away from Maricopa County psychiatric ward. 6 Q At the time you took her back to her house, 7 was she capable of self-care, taking care of herself in 8 any way? 9 A No, no. 10 Q What did you have to learn to do? 11 A Everything for her daily living. I learned 12 how to -- I had to learn how to bathe her. I had to 13 learn how to -- just everything. Everything I do for 14 myself, I did for my mother. 15 Q Was she able to communicate with you 16 verbally -- 17 A Yes. 18 Q -- at that point in time? 19 A Yes. 20 Q What type of -- you could talk about things? 21 A Yes. 22 Q Did you have to learn to do her nails? 23 A Yes. 24 Q How'd you learn how to do that? 25 A I know -- I know how to clip nails. I mean, 1883 1 just -- 2 Q What about fingernail polish and that sort of 3 thing? 4 A Now, there we went to -- we went to the mall, 5 one of those fancy malls, and I went into the cosmetics 6 department where those ladies sell the perfume. And I 7 asked one of them to sit down with me. I explained my 8 mother's condition, and I asked her if she could teach me 9 how to put on my mother's make-up. My mother used to do 10 that. 11 And she spent a couple of hours with me 12 teaching me about foundation and I don't know what it's 13 called, blush, rouge, and there were these steps that I 14 had written down, the concealer and the eye liner and the 15 make-up, the eye shadow. And so as far as the cosmetics 16 things, I learned all that from the lady in the 17 department store. 18 Q And what about her hair, what'd you have to do 19 with her hair? 20 A She had beautiful silky hair. I didn't -- I 21 mean, I knew how she kept her hair, and I just washed her 22 hair the way I wash my hair. 23 Q Did you have to brush her hair? 24 A Yes, I did. 25 Q Did there come a point in time where you 1884 1 learned that she needed to be disimpacted? 2 A Yes, I did. 3 Q Let's put this in context. How long did you 4 live with her in Arizona in her house? 5 A Every day, 24 hours a day, seven days a week. 6 Q For how many months? 7 A For about eight months. 8 Q And during this eight-month period, did her 9 condition remain stable or did it deteriorate? 10 A There was one point where it just -- she -- it 11 just deteriorated completely. 12 Q Before it deteriorated completely, tell the 13 jury what a typical day would have been with your mother. 14 A Typical day would -- starting at what time, 15 Mr. Osborne? 16 Q Starting at the time you started doing 17 something until you stopped doing something. 18 A Well, it never stopped. I mean, I'll start 19 at -- 20 Q Start in the morning. 21 A In the morning. We would wake up. I would -- 22 first thing I would do is she had -- I had bought her -- 23 the way I set it up -- she was incontinent. And the way 24 I would set it up is I bought these pads called Serenity 25 absorbancy pads that have an adhesive back that went 1885 1 inside the Depends that I bought for her. And I would 2 check that, and I would change those immediately, take 3 them off. 4 We would go into the bathroom. I would bathe 5 her from the waist down. I'd get her dressed up. And 6 what I had done previous to that is I had gone to Target, 7 and there was a line of clothing that was very loose, and 8 I would just get her dressed up. 9 From there we would go into the kitchen. I 10 would make breakfast. There was just a lot of things 11 that went into that. There was the Milk of Magnesia. 12 There was the Dulcolax, the stool softeners. Then it was 13 making her the breakfast, getting some lettuce out. 14 Trying to keep her on a high fiber diet, eggs. 15 Q Why the high fiber diet? 16 A Because of her disimpaction problem. 17 Q Okay. 18 A From there, we'd get all set, and I would put 19 on her sneakers. And she was an avid -- long ago she was 20 an avid runner, but she always did the speed walking. 21 And I think by the time we were done, it was about 10:00 22 in the morning, and then we'd go speed walking around the 23 block. And I just wanted to make sure that she 24 maintained her -- I just wanted to keep her agile. I 25 wanted to keep exercising her. 1886 1 We'd walk for about 45 minutes. We would get 2 home. We would have a small meal. Then from there we 3 would drive down to Tempe -- Arizona State University, 4 which is in Tempe, and we'd go on the campus. And I'd 5 say, Mom, are you ready to teach class? Those things 6 would just make her really happy when I would bring her 7 to the university and tell her that she had a class to 8 teach, and she would think that she was still a teacher. 9 I'd go into some of the classes, and I asked a 10 couple of professors -- I would explain my mother's 11 condition, explain that she was a teacher, she was 12 suffering from Alzheimer's, and they would let us sit in 13 the class. I would tell her these are your students, 14 Mom. And she would sit down. It made her happy. It 15 made her very happy. 16 From there, across the campus we'd go to Uno's 17 Pizza. From there, we'd go to a Starbucks. We would 18 come home, and then we'd start -- I'd start with the 19 daily living routine with my mother as far as getting 20 ready to give her a full bath. 21 Q Did you have to brush her teeth? 22 A Well, first I would floss her teeth. She had 23 a chair in her room, and she would lay her head back and 24 she would let me floss her teeth. 25 At that point I was -- I wanted her to do most 1887 1 of the things on her own. She wouldn't floss her teeth 2 on her own, but then I bought her a Sonicare toothbrush, 3 and she enjoyed that. She could hold that, and she would 4 just brush on her own. 5 Q What about bedtime, how did you prepare for 6 that? 7 A That's where we -- where we were getting to. 8 That process, I mean, it just took a lot longer, that 9 process, just walking my mother. There was a lot of role 10 playing. As far as bathing my mother, I tried just to 11 maintain -- at the beginning, it was very disturbing to 12 do these things for my mother, me being her son. 13 What I learned or what I felt is my mother had 14 reverted to going back to being a child. I guess that's 15 what Alzheimer's people do. And when it came to 16 undressing her to give her a shower, I would pretend that 17 I was a doctor, like I did with the disimpaction. I'd 18 say, Mrs. Destefano, we're going to go in and just take a 19 bath, and I'm going to help you with the bath. And she'd 20 say, oh, thank you, Doctor. 21 I bought the stool where she could sit in the 22 shower, and I would give her a full bath. I would take a 23 washcloth, and one of the things I just remembered she 24 loved me to do was just to run the washcloth through her 25 toes, in between the toes. 1888 1 Q When was the first time you realized that you 2 were going to have to disimpact your mother? 3 A It was the first time I brought her back from 4 Maricopa -- well, no. The first time with the problem 5 when I first learned that I had to disimpact my mother 6 was either the second or third time I brought her to the 7 emergency room. 8 Q Where, in Arizona? 9 A In Arizona, yeah. 10 Q What did you find out? Why did you take her 11 to the emergency room, first of all? 12 A Well, she had a problem -- when I first got 13 home from the psychiatric ward -- when we first got home 14 from the psychiatric ward, my mother was in the bathroom. 15 I was alone at the house. I didn't know what to do. I 16 didn't know where to begin. I didn't know what I was 17 going to do. I just knew I had to take -- this was my 18 mother, and I just knew I had to take care of my mom. 19 Q So the question was -- let me go back to this 20 again. In terms of the first time -- let's talk about 21 the first time you ever disimpacted your mother. How did 22 that come about? 23 A Okay, Mr. Osborne. The first time I even knew 24 anything about impaction or the first time I physically 25 disimpacted my mother? 1889 1 Q Let's talk about the first time you first 2 physically disimpacted your mother, how did that come 3 about? 4 A That came about, like I said, either the 5 second time or third time I brought my mother to the 6 hospital. And each time I brought her, we would go to 7 the emergency room, and I explained that I thought that 8 my mother had an impaction problem. And what they did is 9 they made us wait in the emergency room for about -- I 10 think the first time I sat there for about eight hours. 11 We got in there and they put her on the 12 gurney, and this turned into a 30-second procedure. The 13 doctor comes in. He puts on his rubber gloves. He put 14 on the lubricant, and he did an exam. And I was there, 15 and they explained to me my mother was impacted, and they 16 disimpacted her. 17 A week later -- as my mother was walking, she 18 would stop me and say, oh, oh, oh. And I'd ask her what 19 was wrong. I couldn't figure it out. She said I have to 20 go to the bathroom. And she would -- I'd get her on the 21 toilet, and she'd sit on the toilet and nothing was 22 happening. And she was in pain. 23 I brought her to the emergency room again, and 24 we sat there for another six, five hours, I don't know, 25 brought her into the emergency room, and we ran into the 1890 1 same shift nurse that was at the hospital. And, again, 2 it was on the gurney and it was a 30-second procedure and 3 everything was okay. 4 And I don't know if it was that time or the 5 third time when the nurse had come out to me, and she 6 asked who was my mother's healthcare provider. I 7 explained I was. She asked if we have any visiting 8 nurses that came in that helped with the care. I said we 9 didn't. I was her primary caregiver. 10 And she said, do you know that this is a 11 procedure that you can do on your own? I said, I did not 12 know that. And she said, is this a procedure you think 13 you can do on your own? And I said -- I had her explain 14 to me what this procedure involved, what I needed to do. 15 And she told me that you put on -- you've been in the 16 room. You put on the gloves. She explained you use 17 lubricant, and if this happens, it's a very easy, simple 18 procedure. You just needed to be very careful. 19 And she explained all about the hard stooling 20 that happens, the impaction. It happens in elderly 21 people, where she was using medical terms, but basically 22 your bowel movements aren't as active. And she asked if 23 I could do this procedure, and I said -- I said -- she 24 said you could bring her here and sit here for eight or 25 nine hours or you could do it at home. 1891 1 Q That's how you learned to do it? 2 A Well, then I followed it up when I got home. 3 I immediately called Mark Koller. My ex-wife's husband 4 is a registered nurse. He's got a bachelor's of science 5 in nursing. And I called him up, and he spent about a 6 half hour on the phone with me telling me about the 7 procedure in detail and what it involves. And he said 8 not to -- not to panic, don't worry. This is a very 9 simple procedure. 10 Q And did you then thereafter start disimpacting 11 your mother when needed? 12 A Yes, I did. 13 Q Let's talk about the eight months you were in 14 Arizona. You said there came a time when she 15 deteriorated. What happened? 16 A I had to -- when I shut down my business, I 17 moved all my equipment into a smaller ministorage unit 18 that was behind the Greyhound bus station on John Young. 19 And I was still paying rent there, which was about 600 20 dollars a month. 21 Kay had called me. She said, Larry, why don't 22 you at least sell all your equipment in the warehouse so 23 you don't have to spend the 600 dollars a month. Sell 24 all your equipment, and then after you do that, you can 25 go back home to Arizona. She just said it was the 1892 1 prudent thing to do; I agreed. 2 When I was in Arizona, I contacted the 3 Alzheimer's center, and they said that there were people 4 on their list that were called adult care facilities 5 where you could place an elderly parent for either 6 respite care to give yourself some rest or if you had to 7 go somewhere for a limited amount of time. I contacted 8 one of these people, asked this lady to come over to the 9 house. I asked her how much it would cost to put my 10 mother in their home. 11 They have -- it's like a house, and they have 12 three or four people in the house. And she quoted me 13 1500 dollars. I gave her a check for 1500 dollars, and I 14 gave her 1500 dollars cash, and I told her to please, 15 please take care of my mother. 16 She was in a wandering state. I said she was 17 very -- she took up a lot of time. I gave -- my mother 18 was prescribed antianxiety pills. I don't know if they 19 were -- they were Xanaxes. And I gave them the 20 antianxiety pills, and I said this would help with her 21 wandering. 22 Q Let me talk to you about that. When you said 23 she was in this wandering state, what do you mean? 24 A She was always -- she was always pacing, 25 looking in cabinets, going outside the door. In my 1893 1 house, what I had to do was change all the locks so that 2 they were keyed from both sides. You couldn't -- 3 Q This is in Arizona? 4 A Yes. 5 Q So when she was in this wandering state, what 6 did you do yourself to try to assist her from hurting 7 herself if she was wandering? 8 A In the house? 9 Q Yes, when you were -- 10 A There were a number of things I did. One of 11 the things I did was I purchased a -- it's called a gate 12 belt, and it's a wide belt that goes around the waist 13 that has a handle. 14 Actually, I called up the Alzheimer's center 15 or one of the hospitals, and I asked -- my mother had 16 fallen one time, and I asked -- in the middle of the 17 night she would wake up. And I asked -- I asked how can 18 I prevent her from getting up and hurting herself. And 19 they explained that what they do is they use passive 20 restraints. I asked what a passive restraint was, and 21 they said what they typically do is they take a sheet or 22 tear up a sheet, and they just tie the patients to the 23 bed. And -- 24 Q Did you want to do that with your mother? 25 A That was unacceptable. I was not going to -- 1894 1 I was not going to restrain my mother, and I don't call 2 that a passive restraint. So I made the choice -- 3 Q What did you do? 4 A I slept in bed with my mother. I went to bed 5 with my mother, and I slept with her at the house. 6 Q For how long a period of time did you have to 7 do that when you were out in Arizona? 8 A I did that all the time when she was in that 9 wandering state. We went to bed together. I'd say, Mom, 10 ready to go to bed, and we would go to bed. I would 11 sleep with my mother. She would talk; I would talk. She 12 knew I was her son. Sometimes she didn't. We held 13 hands. I cried with her. I was sad. I was upset. 14 Q Were there times that she got up in the middle 15 of the night in a wandering state? 16 A She tried or -- if she wanted to, I would get 17 up with her, and we would walk around together wherever 18 she wanted to go. 19 Q Do you remember what it was that caused her to 20 be hospitalized in Arizona, what the incident was that 21 caused her -- what the disorientation was that caused 22 her -- 23 A Yeah. 24 Q -- to be hospitalized? 25 A Yeah, I think she was -- it was in the 1895 1 neighborhood where she was wandering. They found her 2 wandering on the street. And there was some incident 3 about her trying to dry her clothes, and she had put the 4 clothes in a microwave oven. 5 Q So at some point in time, did you put her in 6 this assisted-living facility so you could come to 7 Florida and close up your business? 8 A I hired them for -- I hired them for a month. 9 I thought it would take a month. I told three or four 10 friends where she was that I met in Arizona, that I was 11 going to Florida, shut down my business, asked if they 12 would check up on her. And so I came back to Florida. 13 Q How long did it take you to sell your 14 equipment and close down your business? 15 A I don't recall how long it took. I was -- I 16 was in the process of doing that when I got a call back 17 from one of the friends who was checking up on her and 18 told me that I -- that my mother wasn't looking good in 19 this adult foster care facility, and that they thought 20 that I needed to get back there immediately. 21 Q What'd you do? 22 A I got on the first plane out, and I got back 23 there immediately. 24 Q What was the condition of your mother when you 25 got there? 1896 1 A I knocked on the door. It was this Filipino 2 couple, husband and wife, that were watching my mother. 3 And they looked through the window. They looked 4 surprised to see me because I was supposed to come back a 5 week later. And they told me they'd be right with me. 6 I stood out there for about five more minutes, 7 and I kept knocking on the door. And they didn't open 8 the door. I remember I started screaming. I wanted them 9 to open the door. And they finally got the door open, 10 and my mother was laying on the couch, and she was 11 nonresponsive. I asked -- 12 Q Go ahead. 13 A I asked what was wrong with my mom. And they 14 said she was just resting. And I went up to her. I 15 said, Mom? And she was nonresponsive. I was asking them 16 what was wrong with my mom, how come she's not talking to 17 me. 18 Q What happened? 19 A And they said she was just resting. And I 20 said, well, she's not. I'm trying to wake her up. And I 21 noticed the bottom of her heels, and she had two ulcers 22 on the bottom of her heels that were about the size of 23 golf balls. It was all purple. It was all filled with 24 blood. 25 Q Had she had those ulcers when you left her 1897 1 there? 2 A No. She was completely healthy. 3 Q What'd you do then? 4 A I picked her up off the couch, and I got her 5 outside the house, and I laid her down on the grass. And 6 I -- I just wanted to assess my mother's condition. I 7 just -- I just pulled her pants down, and that's when I 8 saw -- she had a rash, a real severe rash on her bottom. 9 It was all red. She was all wet. She didn't have the 10 Depends I had given them, instructed them to put on. She 11 was just wearing panties. 12 And there's an area in the back what I now 13 know is the coccyx area. It's the tailbone, and there 14 was just an open wound that was oozing. 15 Q What'd you do then? 16 A I immediately took her to her physician, 17 Dr. Beback. She wasn't there. It was another physician. 18 I brought her there, and they told me that these were 19 ulcers. And he told me what I needed to do to care for 20 them. 21 We made an appointment. He told me where I 22 had to bring her to this wound care center to have the 23 necrotic tissue -- I don't know what they did, cut out, 24 patched up, healed, Accuzyme, cling wrap. 25 Q What'd you do after that once she was treated 1898 1 for that? What'd you decide to do with her in terms of 2 her care and treatment? 3 A Could you be more specific, Mr. Osborne, 4 please? 5 Q Did you move to Florida, back to Florida at 6 that point in time? 7 A No. We stayed in Arizona, and I -- I was in a 8 dilemma. I didn't want to -- I went and took courses at 9 the Alzheimer's center, and they told me that you want to 10 keep an Alzheimer's patient in their surroundings where 11 they're used to. And I had Kay calling me telling me to 12 bring my mother back home, and I was -- I was in a 13 dilemma. 14 And in hindsight, I made the wrong choice in 15 coming back. I should have stayed in Arizona, and I 16 should have kept my mother there, but we came back 17 eventually. 18 Q And when you were -- the last weeks or so you 19 were in Arizona, what was your mother's condition before 20 you came back to Florida? 21 A My mother never recovered from that adult care 22 facility. She -- she just never recovered. 23 Q Did she come to where she could verbalize with 24 you at all? 25 A She could still verbalize with me but very -- 1899 1 she knew who I was. 2 Q How did you communicate with her if she wasn't 3 verbally -- how did she know you were there? 4 A I would hold her hands. I would talk to her. 5 I kissed her. 6 Q How did you kiss your mother? 7 A I kissed my mother on the crook of the mouth. 8 Q Did you ever kiss her full on the lips? 9 A No. 10 Q Passionately? 11 A No. 12 Q So in terms of -- 13 A No. I never kissed my mother passionately on 14 the lips. 15 Q In terms of her responding, how did she 16 respond to your touch? When you held her hand or you 17 kissed her on the crook of the mouth, how did she respond 18 to this? 19 A I didn't learn Spanish because my brother was 20 deaf and they advised my mother not to speak a bilingual 21 language in the household, so she made it a point to 22 speak English. But one of the things she always called 23 me was me as a boy was mi boyeto. And when I was holding 24 her hand -- 25 Q Which means what? 1900 1 A I think it means my little chicken. She would 2 say, mi boyeto, come give me a kiss, and I'd come close 3 and kiss my mom. She wanted that affection. We always 4 did that before she had Alzheimer's. 5 Q When was it you moved her to Florida? 6 A It would have been September, late August, 7 early September. 8 Q Okay. Where did you go -- where did you take 9 your mother when you got off the plane in Orlando? 10 A Kay was there at the airport, picked us up, 11 and then we went to her house. 12 Q How long did you and your mother stay together 13 at Kay's house before you took her to Florida Hospital or 14 she was taken to Florida Hospital? 15 A I would say about a week. 16 Q Okay. And tell the jury what her life was 17 like during that week when Kay was there and you were 18 there and your mother was there. What was the routine, 19 the pattern and that sort of thing? 20 A There was no change in the pattern as far as 21 my care with my mother. I was in total -- I took total 22 care of my mother, and it was just the same daily 23 routine. 24 Q What about -- we've heard about the effect of 25 her mouth being open. Describe that for the jury, from 1901 1 your point of view, your mother's effect with her mouth 2 being open? 3 A I don't recall that. I've heard that 4 throughout the testimony. I do not recall this mouth 5 being open. 6 Q Okay. All right. So how did it come to pass 7 that she had to go to the hospital? 8 A I went to -- I went to pick -- I went to help 9 my mother get up, and that was the first time where she 10 had just went limp. She couldn't get up anymore. And 11 she started -- some saliva started to drool from her 12 mouth. I was afraid that she was having a stroke or had 13 just had a stroke, and I rushed her to Florida Hospital 14 to the emergency room. 15 Q Let me get to that in a minute. During that 16 time, the eight months and week you were caring for your 17 mother, did you have to walk with her or try to keep her 18 walking as a part of your care? 19 A Yes. 20 Q Tell the jury about that. 21 A When we were in College Park, I would get my 22 mother up, and one of the things that I always wanted to 23 do was make sure that my mother was always agile and 24 mobile because I could see as she started to 25 deteriorate -- they call it a cachectic state, where she 1902 1 just started to become rigid. 2 And one of the things I learned was ROM, which 3 is range of motion. And I always wanted to make sure 4 that I stretched her legs, and I always pulled her 5 fingers out, wanted to straighten them out. And I 6 just kept her involved in the daily activities of 7 exercising and walking and walking with her. 8 Q And when you first got out to Arizona, she was 9 able to do that pretty much on her own? 10 A She did that -- we would march together. I'd 11 get in a cadence with her. I'd tell her we were in the 12 military, you know. 13 Q As she deteriorated, then you'd have to do 14 more and more of that assisting with her, correct? 15 A I assisted with her. I was very gentle, did 16 it very slow at her pace. 17 Q How did you get to the hospital, Florida 18 Hospital emergency room? 19 A I brought her there. I carried her there. 20 Q Was the ambulance called? 21 A No. I lifted her up and put her in the car. 22 When we got there, I lifted her out of the car, and I 23 carried her into the emergency room. 24 Q And was there a diagnosis made as to what her 25 condition was while she was in the emergency room at 1903 1 Florida Hospital? 2 A I don't remember. I remember at some point 3 they admitted her. They did the blood work -- I guess it 4 was in the emergency room where they did the blood work 5 and explained to me that she had a urosepsis infection. 6 Q Okay. And how long was she in the hospital on 7 that occasion? 8 A Five days. 9 Q And do you remember the date of that admission 10 just off chance? 11 A Yes, September 15th. 12 Q Who was her treating doctor? 13 A That would have been either -- that would have 14 been Dr. Black. 15 Q Now, in terms of your situation when your 16 mother's in the hospital for that five days, where did 17 you sleep or where did you stay during the five-day 18 hospitalization? 19 A After the incident with the adult care 20 facility, my mother was never going to be left alone with 21 anyone without me being present. My mother was never 22 going to be cared for by anyone without me being present. 23 My mother was never going to be touched by anyone unless 24 I knew who they were, what their qualifications were. 25 And when I was at the hospital, I had asked 1904 1 Dr. Black if it would be okay if I could stay with my 2 mother because I wanted to be with my mother at all 3 times. I never wanted her to leave my sight again or be 4 in the care of anyone else unless I was present. And 5 Dr. Black understood that, and he said it was no problem, 6 and he could make arrangements for me to sleep in the 7 same room with my mother on the fifth floor of Florida 8 Hospital. 9 Q And did you do that? 10 A Yes, I did. 11 Q Did you participate in her care during the 12 time that she was at Florida Hospital for the five days? 13 A Yes, I did. 14 Q In what way? 15 A The same thing I did at home. I did her hair. 16 I bathed her. I flossed her teeth. I fed her. There 17 were many times when the nurses told me, they said, 18 Mr. Destefano, this is our job, and that's what we're 19 here to do. And I would explain to them, I said -- I 20 said, look, there's patients you can -- spend more time 21 with your patients somewhere else. I know how to do 22 this. If you want to do it, you can, but I'm here, and I 23 don't mind doing it. And they said -- they thanked me. 24 Q Did you do your range of motion work with her? 25 A Yes, I did. 1905 1 Q Did you try to walk her around? 2 A I think on one occasion I did, yes. 3 Q Tell the jury how you would do that in the 4 state she was in. How would you try to walk her around? 5 A When she was in the bed -- there was one thing 6 that they did at the hospital, and it was called painful 7 stimuli. And I learned about that because I saw a nurse 8 go into my mother's room, and on her shoulder -- she went 9 up to her shoulder, and she -- I thought she pinched her 10 real hard. I mean, she just grabbed her skin and pinched 11 her, and my mother whined. 12 I asked her, what are you doing? And she 13 explained to me that that was a procedure they used 14 called painful stimuli. And, again, I don't -- I'm 15 not -- 16 Q In terms of -- 17 A -- a doctor, but -- I'm going to answer your 18 question, but as far as the first thing I would do is 19 when I saw my mother laying there, I wanted her to get 20 her exercise, so I would smack my hands in order to get 21 her attention or I'd say, Mom, wake up, and she'd wake 22 up. And I'd sit by the bed and I'd move her legs over to 23 the side of the bed to get her in a sitting position. 24 And I'd help her off the bed. And that one 25 time I wanted to see if I could get her back up to 1906 1 walking again, and her legs were weak. Her legs gave 2 out, and I stopped because she slumped over a little bit. 3 I stopped and I put her back on the bed, and I didn't 4 proceed to do that anymore. 5 Q Did you have any problems with anybody at 6 Florida Hospital during that five-day stay? 7 A I never had any problems with anyone. 8 Q What was -- at the end of that 9 hospitalization, upon discharge time, how was the 10 decision made to transfer your mother? 11 A Dr. Black knew that while my mother was at the 12 hospital from the 15th to the 19th, he knew that I was 13 looking for housing for my mother. We had sold her house 14 out in Arizona. I was looking for a house for us, and he 15 knew that I was going in and out. 16 He asked me -- on the 19th, he asked me if I 17 had found any house I was interested in. I said I was 18 still looking for housing. He said, I'll tell you what, 19 Larry. You're her sole care provider. Why don't -- why 20 don't I write an order for physical therapy. We'll 21 transfer her across the street to Sunbelt Health Care and 22 Subacute Center. 23 I didn't know it was a nursing home. The name 24 on the outside is called Sunbelt Health Care and Subacute 25 Center. He said I'll write an order for five more days 1907 1 of physical therapy. They'll take care of her over there 2 and that will give you time to continue looking for 3 housing with your real estate agent. 4 Q Were you staying in a hotel? 5 A At that time, I was. 6 Q Where was the hotel? 7 A It was right up the road. It was the 8 Courtyard Marriott, I think it's called, on Rollins. 9 Q Did you check into the hotel at the time your 10 mother was hospitalized or before that? 11 A I checked in -- right when she was 12 hospitalized I checked in. 13 Q Okay. So that's how the decision was made to 14 send her to what you now know to be a nursing home? 15 A Yes. 16 Q And when did you first go see your mother at 17 the nursing home? 18 A It was that evening. She was transferred. 19 And by policy, they transferred her -- because I said I 20 could just bring her over on a wheelchair. It was right 21 across the street from Florida Hospital, but they said 22 they had to use an ambulance, so they brought her by 23 ambulance. And I walked in there, and -- what was your 24 question? 25 Q When is the first time you saw her at the 1908 1 nursing home? 2 A That was the first time I saw her. 3 Q On the 19th? 4 A On the 19th, that evening. 5 Q What time was that; do you remember? 6 A Whenever the transfer -- I'm sure it's on the 7 transfer sheet or whenever it was brought over. It was 8 around twilight. 9 Q All right. And did you -- what happened after 10 you got into -- did you go into her room? 11 A I went into the facility and I knew something 12 was seriously wrong, but, yes, I went into her room. 13 Q Who was there -- was anybody there with you at 14 the time? 15 A Yes. There was a nurse, and they had put 16 her -- she was in a room with another lady, and I asked 17 if she could have a private room, and they said sure. 18 Q You said you knew something was seriously 19 wrong. What were you talking about? 20 A I just saw -- I just saw the level of care 21 just diminish rapidly from what I was used to at the 22 hospital to this facility I just walked into. I could 23 smell the urine. I could smell -- there was just a foul 24 odor of feces, urine. 25 Q So did you get your mother changed -- moved to 1909 1 a private room? 2 A I asked if she could have a private room, and 3 there was a little discussion about that. And I 4 finally -- I think I convinced them to give my mother a 5 private room. And then after that, I asked if I could 6 get a -- I asked if I could have a cot brought to my 7 mother's room so I could stay in my mother's room. And 8 they asked me why, and I said I was very concerned with 9 my mother, and I wanted to be next to her. 10 And I said I would help with her care. And 11 they went to a -- I think it was the nurse manager who 12 was there that evening who was staying late or something, 13 and I think it was -- I think it was Mary Thornton. They 14 brought me to Mary Thornton, and I asked Mary Thornton if 15 I could have -- if I could stay with my mother. And she 16 said absolutely not. We don't allow that. That's not 17 our policy. 18 Q What'd you do then? 19 A I went back to the hotel. 20 Q Okay. When did you come back to the nursing 21 home after that? 22 A The very next morning. 23 Q What happened then? 24 A My mother's breakfast tray was still there. 25 Breakfast was over. They served it, but no one had 1910 1 opened up the lid. There was no pitcher of water there. 2 So I just went and got the water, and I started feeding 3 my mother breakfast. 4 Q Let me ask you this. When did the incident 5 that the jury's heard about all week with Carol Boze 6 happen about the wound dressing? 7 A That would have been that evening. 8 Q The night before? 9 A No. She went in on the 19th. 10 Q Correct. 11 A I came in the next morning on the 20th, gave 12 her breakfast, then I went back out with the realtor. I 13 think it was some lady that was taking me out over to 14 DeLand to look at some housing over there. We got done 15 there, and I came back in the afternoon. 16 I was -- there was some concerns, but I still 17 had to go look for some more housing. I was going to go 18 look. There was some more listings that were with the 19 same agent, and then I came back that evening at about 20 5:30. I came into my mother's room. I walked in, and I 21 saw that -- I saw that there was no wound dressing on my 22 mother. It seemed like some nurse had come in, and it 23 was -- it was pretty frazzled. 24 It was around 5:30. They were passing out 25 dinner trays. The med carts were out, and it just looked 1911 1 like a new shift had come on. And it just seemed very 2 hectic and frazzled, and the nurses were trying to get 3 things done. 4 When I went into my mother's room, there was 5 no -- it just seemed like the nurse had taken off the 6 wound dressing but had forgotten to come back and put it 7 back on. I came out of my mother's room. There was a 8 nurse, Carol Boze, standing outside -- 9 Q Did you know the nurse was Carol Boze? 10 A No, not at the time. 11 Q So you came out, and you saw a nurse? 12 A Yes. 13 Q What happened then? 14 A I came up to the nurse, and I just said, I 15 know you're real busy, but I just wanted to let you know 16 that some nurse had inadvertently forgot to put a wound 17 dressing on my mother. 18 Q And what did she say? 19 A She snapped at me, and she said, I'm real busy 20 right now. 21 Q What did you do? 22 A I said, I understand, no problem. I went back 23 in my mother's room, waited around 15 more minutes. I 24 came back out to Nurse Boze, and I asked -- 25 Q Did you know she was Nurse Boze at this time? 1912 1 A No, I did not. 2 Q Came back out to a nurse, and what happened? 3 A I came back out to the same nurse I had just 4 spoken to. And I said, excuse me, Miss, I just wanted to 5 remind you there was no wound dressing on my mother, and 6 I was just kind of wondering how long it would take to 7 get one on. And she snapped at me, and she said I told 8 you I'm busy. 9 Q What'd you do then? 10 A Went back into my mother's room. And I 11 remember -- I clearly remember thinking how I am going to 12 deescalate this and try to get this problem resolved 13 without it escalating or going -- I just sat in there for 14 about 15 more minutes, and I thought about it, and I 15 thought I came up with the perfect plan. And I came out, 16 and I said -- I said to the nurse, Ma'am, I'm my mother's 17 healthcare provider. I have dressed this wound many 18 times for many months, and if you could just give me the 19 4-by-4, the clean wrap and the Accuzyme, I would be more 20 than happy to dress my mother's wound. And her response 21 to me was I wasn't authorized. 22 Q Then what happened? 23 A Then I got pissed. 24 Q What'd you do? 25 A I went back in my mother's room, and I was 1913 1 angry that -- there was -- there was a little pad in the 2 room, and I wrote down 6:15, Carolina Destefano, no wound 3 dressing -- or I wrote 6:15 p.m., 9/20/99, no wound 4 dressing on Carolina Destefano, and then I put a 5 signature. I put an S with the slashes and the signature 6 line. 7 I went back out and I asked her what her name 8 was, and -- 9 Q Hang on a second, Mr. Destefano. 10 MR. OSBORNE: Could I have Plaintiff's 5 in 11 evidence, please? 12 Q I'm going to show you what's in evidence, 13 Mr. Destefano, as Plaintiff's No. 5, and ask if that is 14 the note that you're talking about. 15 A Yes, it is. 16 Q 9/20/99. And publish for the jury what the 17 note says before we talk about how Ms. Boze signed that. 18 A It says: Sunbelt Health Care, 9/29/99, 19 Orlando, 6:15 p.m. No wound dressing on Carolina 20 Destefano, Room 30 -- and the number's -- the copy didn't 21 grab the number. 22 Q 307, was that her room number? 23 A Room 307. 24 Q Let me ask you this -- go ahead. Do the rest 25 of it. 1914 1 A I wrote witness, and then I put a line and 2 then I wrote her name at the bottom, Carol. 3 Q When you came up with what you thought was a 4 perfect plan, did you really expect the nurse to sign the 5 note? 6 A No. 7 Q What'd you think -- what'd you expect to 8 happen once you presented her with a note? 9 A I knew what would happen is she would look at 10 this note and say I'm not signing that note, but I'll go 11 put a wound dressing on your mother. 12 Q What happened instead? 13 A She took out her pen, defiantly signed the 14 note, and said, there. Do you think this is going to 15 make me do my job any faster? And she handed me the note 16 back. 17 Q Okay. What did you do after you got the note 18 back from Carol Boze? 19 A Folded up the note. My mother had a -- there 20 was a bootie that -- when they put a wound dressing on my 21 mother, there's a boot that's foam, that has a lot of 22 foam that they put under it. And the bootie was off to 23 the side of the bed. I put her heel in the bootie. I 24 put a pillow under her calf just to elevate it to keep 25 any pressure off the wound. 1915 1 I left, put the note in my pocket, and went to 2 go to sleep so that I could be back first thing in the 3 morning to get my mother out of -- 4 Q You went to your hotel room? 5 A To my hotel room right up the street. I was 6 tired. I was out looking for homes all day, and I knew I 7 needed to get a good night's rest to get my mother out of 8 there first thing in the morning. 9 Q So you came back in the next morning at what 10 time? 11 A I don't know if it was 8:00 or 9:00, 8:30. I 12 don't know. 13 Q Okay. What happened? What'd you do when you 14 came in? 15 A I came in, was walking down the hallway. I 16 think someone yelled at me. I don't know if it was Mary. 17 Q You didn't know who it was at the time, did 18 you? 19 A Excuse me? 20 Q Did you know who Mary Thornton was on the 21 morning of the 21st? 22 A No, no. 23 Q You heard somebody yell at you, and what 24 happened next? 25 A I heard someone yell at me from the office, 1916 1 and I heard something like -- someone yelled out you need 2 to talk to someone or, I don't know, about me being in 3 trouble or something. I wasn't paying attention. I was 4 just making a beeline for my mother's room. 5 And as I got to my mother's room, there were 6 three or four individuals, suits and ties, you know, and 7 I went passed them, walked into my mother's room. And 8 the next thing I knew is I had two ladies follow me 9 inside. 10 Q Okay. What happened then? 11 A They started screaming at me. 12 Q Do you know who those two ladies were? 13 A Yes. 14 Q Who? 15 A Mary Thornton and Rachel Bean. 16 Q Did you know at the time before they started 17 screaming at you? 18 A Who they were? 19 Q Who they were at that time? 20 A No. 21 Q What were they saying to you? 22 A Sir, we understand you got one of our staff 23 members to sign a note last night. They were screaming 24 what you did is illegal and unauthorized, and you need to 25 return that note back immediately. 1917 1 Q Who was doing the talking or were they both 2 doing it or do you remember? 3 A No. My mother -- this screaming had woke my 4 mother up, and I asked them -- I begged -- I begged them. 5 I said, please, this is my mother. Please don't shout in 6 the room. And they were both shouting that what I did 7 was illegal. They wanted this note back. 8 I said -- I asked who was in charge. Rachel 9 Bean said that she was in charge. She was the director 10 of nursing. And I said, who are you? She said she was 11 the nurse manager. I said, could you please step out of 12 the room? I'll talk to one -- I said, I'll talk to the 13 person in charge. Mary Thornton said she wasn't leaving 14 the room. 15 And at that time -- because I had seen -- 16 there's a poster called the Bill of Rights, Patient's 17 Bill of Rights, when you enter the facility that explains 18 that your room is your mother's residence. And I told 19 Mary Thornton to leave the room, and she said she wasn't 20 leaving the room. I told her you're leaving the room. 21 This is my residence. This is my mother's residence. I 22 want you out of the room. You're happy to stay, 23 Mrs. Bean. I'll talk to you. You're the director of 24 nursing. And I without touching her but moving forward 25 escorted her out of the room. 1918 1 Q Where was this note they wanted back at the 2 time they were having this discussion with you? Did you 3 have it with you? 4 A It might have been in my -- I don't know. It 5 might have been in my pocket. 6 Q Did you give them back the note? 7 A No. 8 Q Why not? 9 A I don't like people telling me what I need to 10 do when I don't have to. I mean, if -- 11 Q What happened next after Mary Thornton left 12 the room? 13 A Rachel Bean told me that she wanted that note 14 back. She wanted that note back. She wanted me to get 15 that note back. And if I didn't get that note back, that 16 she was going to call the police. I said, for what? And 17 she kept telling me that what I did was illegal and 18 unauthorized, and I said, call the police. Go ahead. 19 Q What happened next? 20 A Four police officers showed up. 21 Q And had Rachel Bean left the room alone with 22 you and your mother so you and your mother were there 23 alone? 24 A Yes. 25 Q And then the police came, and then what 1919 1 happened? 2 A Police came in the room, and they surrounded 3 me. And they said, sir, you need to leave your mother's 4 room, and I was in a lot of trouble. 5 Q Now, did you leave? 6 A Yes. I had to leave. 7 Q The police trespass warning that's in evidence 8 as issued by the facility says that you were trespassed 9 at 10:10 in the morning on the 21st. Does that comport 10 with your recollection? 11 A Yes. 12 Q At any point in time before you were 13 trespassed, did you see bright red blood on your mother's 14 bed pad? 15 A Could I see that note again, please? 16 Q Certainly. 17 A When I came back in the morning, I made 18 another notation on 9/21/99. Can I publish that? 19 Q You certainly can. That's in evidence. 20 A This is the morning I came back when Rachel 21 Bean and Carol Boze came in my mother's room. And I 22 wrote 9/21/99 underneath the first note, and it says: 23 Mom still in same position as last night, not moved or 24 rotated to keep off wounds on buttocks. 25 If I had seen bright red blood on my mother's 1920 1 pad, I wouldn't be talking about this. I would have 2 noted the bright red blood on the pad and put it on the 3 note. 4 Q What was the period of time between the time 5 you wrote that, that 9/21 note, and the time that Rachel 6 Bean and Mary Thornton came in and started yelling at 7 you? How long had you been in the room? 8 A I think I was still writing this note when 9 they came in the room. 10 Q Okay. So if -- 11 A That's right. I did have the note. I had the 12 note, right, because I was writing that note when I got 13 there. 14 Q So if Rachel Bean told Dr. Black that you told 15 her -- 16 A I'm -- 17 Q Go ahead. 18 A Now I'm recalling the events. 19 Q Go ahead. 20 A I'm recalling the events because Rachel Bean 21 was telling me -- when she was telling me what I did the 22 night before was illegal and unauthorized, what I did is 23 I said I don't see how that can be because -- I had 24 pulled out the note. And I said, I don't see how it 25 could be illegal and unauthorized because I'm going to 1921 1 make a notation right now, and I see that my mother's 2 still in the same position and she hasn't been rotated, 3 and I started writing this note underneath. 4 Q So at the time that you supposedly told Rachel 5 Bean that you saw the blood, in fact, you did not see the 6 blood, correct? 7 A There was no blood. There was no discussion 8 of blood. That whole discussion never even took -- there 9 was never a discussion about blood. 10 Q And when the police came, were you in the 11 presence of the police and Rachel Bean and yourself all 12 together? 13 A Yes. 14 Q Did Rachel Bean make one word or one sound 15 about there being blood on the bed to the police? 16 A No, there was never -- there has never been 17 any discussion to the police about blood on the pad. 18 Q How did you feel as your mother's primary 19 caregiver as being trespassed from the facility so you 20 could not be with your mother? 21 A I was scared. 22 Q Why was that? 23 A I was scared because these nurses were -- were 24 very angry with me for getting a note signed. I was 25 scared because I was the only one who could protect my 1922 1 mother. I was scared because I knew Rachel Bean and Mary 2 Thornton didn't love my mother. This was my mother, and 3 I was being thrown out of a facility where I couldn't 4 protect my mother. 5 Q So what'd you do? 6 A A friend of mine, Jaime Clark, picked up -- 7 I'm sorry. The police had me outside, and there was 8 Officer Raelin, Officer Olstrom -- I'm trying to 9 remember. There were four officers. Officer Sanchez was 10 one of them. 11 And I told them that -- I told them that I was 12 going back inside. I was trying to -- I was pleading 13 with them. I was trying to explain that you've got some 14 angry nurses that are talking about a note, and they're 15 pissed off and that they want me to bring back the note. 16 You're trespassing me, and you're leaving my mother alone 17 with these people that are angry. 18 And the officers were -- they were just doing 19 their job. But there was this one young officer that I 20 remember, he had blond hair and blue eyes, and he came up 21 to me -- and things were escalating. It was -- things 22 were really starting to escalate because I was not -- I 23 was not about to leave my mother in there, and he wanted 24 to calm things down. 25 And he asked me, what is it that you want to 1923 1 do, sir? What is it that you're concerned about that you 2 want to do? And I said, I want my mother transferred 3 back over to Florida Hospital. And he said -- Mary 4 Thornton and Rachel Bean were outside smoking on the 5 patio, and I was out on the sidewalk. And he said, if I 6 go over to them and ask them to transfer your mother to 7 Florida Hospital, will you calm down and leave the 8 premises? And I said, yes, if I get those assurances. 9 So the officer went over, spoke to Rachel Bean 10 and Mary Thornton in the courtyard, came over after two 11 minutes and he said, Mr. Destefano, they promised me and 12 assured me they would transfer your mother right across 13 the street to your mother's doctor, and she'll be over 14 there in a couple of hours, and is that okay with you. 15 And I became real calm, and my friend Jaime Clark picked 16 me up, and we just drove around for a couple of hours 17 waiting. 18 Q At some point, did you get a call from Rachel 19 Bean? 20 A Yes, when I was driving around with Jaime. 21 Q What did she tell you? 22 A I got a call on the phone. She said, 23 Mr. Destefano, this is Rachel Bean. I said, yes, 24 Ms. Bean. She said, we transferred your mother over to 25 ORMC. And I remember I screamed at her. That wasn't my 1924 1 mother's hospital. And I said, why did you do that? And 2 she said to keep you and your mother as far the hell away 3 from us as possible. I said, lady, you -- 4 Q Those were her exact words? 5 A Those were her exact words. 6 Q What did you do after you found that out, 7 after you found out that contrary to your wishes, that 8 she had been transferred to a different hospital than 9 Florida Hospital? 10 A I told Jaime to bring me -- he had a little 11 shop, little antique store called Shaylin Interiors on 12 Virginia Drive. He had paints in the back for touching 13 up furniture, and he had a poster card. I said bring me 14 to your shop. He brought me to the shop, and I wrote a 15 sign that said Florida Hospital affiliate Sunbelt Nursing 16 Home abuses and neglects the elderly. They did it to my 17 mom, or words to that effect. 18 And it was a little -- it was a little 3 foot 19 by 2 foot sign. I told him to bring me back to the 20 corner of the nursing home. I went back there, and I 21 stood there until about 5:00, 4:00 or 5:00. 22 Q Would you call that picketing? 23 A Yeah. 24 Q Why did you picket? Why did you decide to 25 picket Sunbelt Nursing -- 1925 1 A I wanted to get the attention of the hospital. 2 Q What did you want them to do? 3 A I wanted -- I wanted someone -- well, I did 4 get them to do what I wanted them to do because someone 5 from the hospital came up to me -- Mr. Irv Hamilton came 6 up to me, and he introduced himself. He said he was with 7 human relations or public relations, and he asked me what 8 the problem was. 9 I told him what they did to my mother as far 10 as transferring her. He said, how can we resolve this 11 problem? I said, we could have resolved this problem if 12 you guys did what you said you were going to do by 13 transferring my mother back over to Florida Hospital. 14 And he said, if we transfer your mother from ORMC back to 15 Florida Hospital, will you put your sign down? And I 16 said, absolutely. And he said, will you shake on that, 17 and he stuck out his hand, and I said, yeah, I'll shake 18 on it, and we shook hands and we made a deal. I put my 19 sign down, and I rushed over to ORMC. 20 In the interim, I had called Kay to let her 21 know what had happened. 22 Q Let me ask you this. In terms of picketing, 23 had you picketed before in your lifetime other than this? 24 A I picketed one other time in my life. 25 Q Tell the jury about that. 1926 1 A I had a motorcycle. It was a Yamaha. I've 2 owned four of them. This one turned out to have many, 3 many problems. When I bought the motorcycle, you can get 4 an extended warranty with the motorcycle, and you have up 5 to a year to choose if you want that extended warranty. 6 I had problems with this motorcycle for the first year, 7 so I thought I'd better get this extended warranty. It's 8 called a YES warranty, the Yamaha Extended Service 9 warranty. 10 I bought that, which gave me three more years, 11 and extended the warranty by three more years. There 12 were many problems with the bike. They had to change the 13 engine out. There was a problem with the transmission, 14 and they never resolved the problem. And there was never 15 any -- they always gave me perfect service. I'd bring 16 the bike back in, and I think there are 26 incidents 17 where I had to bring the bike in under this extended 18 service warranty program. 19 And finally, I went back in, I think it was 20 the 23rd, 24th time, and Mike, the owner of the shop, he 21 said -- he said, geez, not you again, Larry. I said, 22 yeah, it went out. I had to get towed back. I think I 23 was out -- I think I was heading towards the Keys. They 24 towed me back. 25 He went in the office, and I asked him how 1927 1 long they thought it would take to fix it. And he sat 2 there, and he said, Larry, we're not going to fix your 3 bike anymore. And I looked at Mike and I said, Mike -- I 4 pulled out my Yamaha extended warranty card. I said, 5 Mike, it's still under warranty. He said, I don't care, 6 Larry. We're not going to fix your bike anymore. 7 I asked him, I said -- I mean, I just didn't 8 understand what he was saying. I said, I paid for an 9 extended warranty. You have to fix my bike. He said, 10 we're not doing it, sue us, do whatever you want, we're 11 not going to fix it. We're tired of working on your 12 bike. 13 I got a sign, stood out there for a week, 14 and -- that's what I did. 15 Q Did they call the police on you too? 16 A Yeah, they called the police on me. 17 Q What'd the police say? 18 A The police came over said, what's the problem? 19 And I said, it goes into a false neutral. A false 20 neutral is -- when you pull the clutch in and you go from 21 first to second and you go to pop the clutch, it will go 22 into second. But a false neutral is when you pop it from 23 first gear to second gear, and it gets stuck. And you 24 pop the clutch and you'll just hear the clutch grind, but 25 it won't -- it won't jump into second gear. 1928 1 And the cops asked me to simulate the problem, 2 and I did. And they heard it, and they said, let's see 3 your Yamaha extended service warranty card. They looked 4 at the card, and they said, hold on a second. They went 5 back in. The two motorcycle officers came back out, and 6 they told me that if they called -- if they called them 7 again, they're the ones that would be going to jail. 8 Q Did you get a new motorcycle? 9 A I got a new motorcycle. 10 Q Okay. Let's go next to your -- going back to 11 this chronology when you called Kay. 12 A Yes. 13 Q Did Kay tell you where your mother was or was 14 it Rachel Bean that told you first where your mother was? 15 A Rachel Bean told me where my mother was. I 16 told Kay to get down there, please, immediately and find 17 out -- first of all, I didn't understand how -- I didn't 18 understand how you could just take a patient and just 19 take them, you know, on the word of -- I was my mother's 20 healthcare provider, and I couldn't understand how other 21 people could come in and just decide where they wanted to 22 put my mother. 23 Q So what time was it when you went over to 24 ORMC? 25 A After Irv Hamilton assured me that my mother 1929 1 would be brought back over to Florida Hospital, I headed 2 over there. Again, it was about twilight, evening. 3 Q And did find your mother? 4 A She was in the emergency room. 5 Q And was there somebody else in the room with 6 her? 7 A There was a lady in the bed next to her, and 8 we introduced ourselves. My mother was laying there. 9 And at some point -- I know that she had family members. 10 Her husband came and her children or some other family 11 members came. There were like three or four people on 12 the other side. I was there with Kay and my mom. 13 Q And did you talk to any doctors that night? 14 A No one spoke -- I'm sorry. I wanted to see my 15 doctor. It was Dr. Wilson, who I recognize now. I went 16 up to Dr. Wilson. She put up her hand, and she said, 17 stay away from me. I don't want to talk to you. She 18 walked away from me. There were only three people that 19 spoke to me that night. 20 Q Who were those three people? 21 A She was the one that told me to stay away from 22 her. She didn't want to speak to me. The second person 23 were the people next door to me. And the third person, 24 which was 1:00 in the morning, was the paramedics who had 25 told me that they were taking my mother to Florida 1930 1 Hospital. Other than that, no one in that hospital -- no 2 one in the ER would speak to me. 3 Q What was their attitude toward you? How did 4 they treat you, from your perspective, your point of 5 view? 6 A Like I was a disgusting pervert, like I was 7 just a disgusting deviant pervert. 8 Q You didn't know at this point in time anything 9 about what anybody had said about you in these medical 10 records, did you? 11 A No, no, I didn't. 12 Q So at the time -- I'm not talking about what 13 you know now after seeing these medical records. At the 14 time, how were they treating you? What were they 15 treating you like? 16 A They gave me a look like I was some kind of 17 disgusting monster, and they didn't want to come near me. 18 They did not speak to me, and they didn't say a word to 19 me. And they didn't want to talk -- no one wanted to 20 talk to me. When I went up to -- when I went up to 21 people, they just ignored me. There was no response. I 22 would ask questions. No one would say a word to me. 23 Q So at what point in time does your mother get 24 transferred to Florida Hospital? 25 A It was about 1:00 in the morning. 1931 1 Q Were you still there at the time of the 2 transfer? 3 A Yes, I was. 4 Q What'd you do then? 5 A I followed the ambulance in my vehicle over to 6 Florida Hospital. 7 Q And were you there when she was admitted? 8 A No. I had to park my vehicle. They had 9 already brought my mother in. I went in through the 10 front door. I became friends with the guy. I think his 11 name was Bob. He was a guard at night who stood at the 12 information desk at the front of Florida Hospital. I 13 walked up to Bob, and he said -- 14 Q This is someone you knew from the first 15 hospitalization, correct? 16 A Yeah. 17 Q Go ahead. What did he say? 18 A He didn't want to speak to me, said he had 19 nothing to say to me. I was surprised about that. 20 Q So what'd you do next? 21 A I was trying to find out -- I'm trying to find 22 out how I knew she was on the ninth floor, and I don't 23 recall. All I do remember is that at that point, there 24 was security personnel there that followed me, went in 25 the elevator. At the time, I didn't know it was -- or I 1932 1 just know that there were security personnel with me in 2 the elevator and as I wound up on the ninth floor. There 3 was always security personnel with me at all times. 4 Q This was still like 1:30, 2:00 in the morning 5 at this point? 6 A 1:30 in the morning. 7 Q So how long did you stay there that night? 8 A I went up to the nurse's station, and I asked 9 if Carolina Destefano was here. The nurse said, yes. I 10 said, I'd like to see my mother. She said, you have to 11 wait outside. We're not done with her. I sat outside 12 for about 15 minutes, came back up. I said, could I see 13 my mother? And she said, you have to wait outside, that 14 they weren't done with her. 15 And I think I wound up sitting there for about 16 an hour and a half, and I came up, and I said, I'd like 17 to see my mother. She said I couldn't see my mother now. 18 I ignored her, and I went down through each room looking 19 for my mother until I found her. And she was laying -- 20 she was laying in a bed, and there was a guard or, I'm 21 sorry, a -- 22 Q A sitter? 23 A A sitter in the room. And I wanted to know -- 24 I asked the lady what she was doing here, and she said, I 25 have to stay here. And I asked why she had to stay 1933 1 there, and she said she didn't know. She just had to 2 stay there. I asked her to please leave the room. I 3 wanted to be alone with my mother. She said she was 4 not -- she was told that she couldn't leave the room. 5 And I was tired. My mother was in a beautiful 6 bed, sheets were clean. She was in a clean environment, 7 and I just wanted to go home. I felt she was safe, and I 8 just went home. 9 Q Did you come back the next morning? 10 A Yes, I did. 11 Q What time was that? 12 A I'd say about 9:30, 10:00. 13 Q And what happened when you came back the next 14 morning? 15 A Came back the next morning. When I walked 16 into the hospital, it seemed like these guards magically 17 appeared again. Two guys came in the elevator with me, 18 went up to the ninth floor, followed me to my mother's 19 room. Doctors, nurses, the sitter was there, and it just 20 seemed like -- just seemed like that there was -- I just 21 felt -- I don't know how to describe it. It just -- I 22 just felt like I was in a lot of trouble, and I didn't 23 know what was going on. And it just felt like the mob 24 effect. 25 I got in my mother's room. The sitter was 1934 1 there. I was holding my mother's -- I went to hold my 2 mother's hand and a woman, tall woman, came inside, and 3 she lifted the sheet on my mother. And I asked -- I 4 said -- I was polite. I said, who are you? And she 5 looked at me, and she said, who are you? And I said, I'm 6 my mother's healthcare provider. I'm her health 7 caregiver, and I've got power of attorney. 8 I said, who are you? And she said, no, you're 9 not. As of right now, you're an alleged sexual 10 perpetrator, and I told her to get her hands off my 11 mother. I said, get your hands off my mother. 12 Q What happened then? 13 A She said, sir, you need to leave the room. I 14 said, no, you need to get your hands off my mother. She 15 said, if you don't leave the room, I'm going to call the 16 cops. The guards were in the room. Doctors were forming 17 at the front door, and the voices were starting to raise. 18 And I was -- yeah, I was -- I was -- I was pissed off. I 19 was just told I was an alleged sexual perpetrator, and I 20 didn't know what was going on. I was scared. I got on 21 the phone, called Kay. 22 Q Was this in the room or had you left the room? 23 A I didn't leave the room. 24 Q What'd you do then, call Kay? 25 A I called Kay. 1935 1 Q And she came over? 2 A I said come over immediately. I said I needed 3 her help. I was all alone. I said I was all alone. 4 Please come down. And -- 5 Q What happened next? 6 A Judy Simms left the room. The two guards were 7 standing in the room. The nurses and doctors had 8 dispersed. The sitter was there. And I think five 9 minutes passed, and Officer Fetzer showed up. And when 10 Officer Fetzer showed up, the DCFS investigator was in, 11 and Officer Fetzer screamed at me and said, sir, are you 12 going to leave the room or do you want me to air your 13 dirty laundry in public? I said, air my dirty laundry in 14 public. 15 And he shouted at me again. He said, are you 16 going to leave this room right now or do you want me to 17 air your dirty laundry in public? I said, I want you to 18 air my dirty laundry in public. I'm taking that choice, 19 sir. All right? I don't want to leave the room. I want 20 you to air my dirty laundry in public. 21 At that time, Kay came running inside, and Kay 22 yelled out, what dirty laundry? Tell us, what's the 23 dirty laundry? Then he reached around and started to 24 pull the handcuffs out of the back, and I just said -- I 25 just said, I'm leaving the room. I couldn't -- I 1936 1 couldn't take the chance of going to jail. 2 Q What happened next? 3 A They got me out in the hallway, and Officer 4 Fetzer said, let me give you some advice, Buddy. This 5 lady wants to do -- she wants to do an investigation, and 6 she wants to interrogate you. And he goes, I can tell 7 you how you can make it go real well and real smooth. I 8 said, how's that? He said, why don't you cooperate with 9 the interrogation. I said, where is this interrogation 10 going to take place? 11 And he asked if -- there was a lady named 12 Trudy Stabilla. At the time they called it patient 13 relations. And I thought that -- I thought that she was 14 going to help me out. I mean, I thought she was an 15 advocate for the patients. And she was real nice, and 16 she said we had a conference room that we could go in. 17 We went inside the ninth floor of this 18 conference room, and Judy Simms sat down. And the first 19 thing I said is I said -- I asked Trudy Stabilla, I said, 20 before we start these proceedings, could I have a video 21 camera? And she just sat there. She had a legal pad, 22 and she just sat there, and she shook her head no. And I 23 said -- I said -- I said, can I get a -- can we videotape 24 these proceedings? And I said, do you have a video 25 recorder in the hospital? And she said -- she said, no. 1937 1 I said, okay. Can we at least audiotape these 2 proceedings? I wanted -- I wanted an audio recording of 3 this interrogation. And Trudy Stabilla wouldn't provide 4 a video camera or an audiotape to record these 5 proceedings. And Officer Fetzer said you've got nothing 6 to worry about, sit down. My girlfriend was there. We 7 sat down. 8 Q What happened next? 9 A Judy Simms started to ask me questions, and I 10 stopped her, and I wanted to make very -- I remember I 11 wanted to make one thing definitively clear. If these 12 were questions that she was just going to ask 13 arbitrarily, I was going to refuse to answer them. If 14 these were questions that were allegations that were 15 being made against me and she knew who it was that made 16 the allegations, I didn't want to know their name, I'd be 17 more than happy, you know, to answer the charges. 18 If these were allegations by anonymous people, 19 I was not going to answer the questions. I was not going 20 to answer any allegations that were made anonymously or 21 that were just arbitrary. I wanted to make sure that 22 these were questions that were allegations made by a 23 specific -- specifically by someone, and Judy Simms said 24 these were specific allegations. 25 MS. MARSHALL: Objection, hearsay, Your Honor. 1938 1 THE COURT: Sustained. 2 Q Okay. So you had this discussion with Judy 3 Simms? 4 A Yes. 5 Q And as a result of these discussions with Judy 6 Simms, what was your impression, in your mind, of what 7 you were being accused of? 8 A After the discussion? 9 Q After the discussions, the questions with Judy 10 Simms, what in your mind -- what act was it that you were 11 perceiving you were being accused of? 12 A I was being accused of sexually sodomizing my 13 mother, molesting my mother, having oral sex with my 14 mother. 15 Q Now, after these questions from Judy Simms -- 16 A If -- 17 Q -- and after you drew that conclusion, what 18 did you do? 19 A Officer Fetzer told me to walk downstairs with 20 him, told me to calm down. We went out to his police 21 car. He offered me a cigarette, and he told me to calm 22 down. He said there was no problems. He said I'm 23 sorry -- I'm sorry. He apologized for yelling at me in 24 there. He was just doing his job. What he had heard was 25 different from what took place in the, you know, with 1939 1 Judy Simms. And he just calmed me down, and then I -- 2 from that point on, to be honest with everyone, from that 3 point on, I don't know what happened. I -- I really 4 don't. 5 Q Let me ask you this. 6 A I really don't know what happened. 7 Q Let me ask you this, Mr. Destefano. I'm going 8 to go through things that are in evidence, and I want you 9 to listen. 10 Mary Thornton testified you were witnessed 11 giving your mother a passionate kiss for an extended 12 time. Carol Boze has testified and it's in the records 13 that you were found on top of your mother kissing her 14 repeatedly on the mouth. Rachel Bean says that you were 15 witnessed kissing your mother intimately on the lips and 16 that you noticed or that she noticed bright red blood on 17 the pad. 18 Carol Boze says that you were kissing your 19 mother passionately on the mouth for approximately two 20 minutes. The paramedics were told that your mother's 21 being taken there for evaluation of bowel impaction. 22 Nursing staff reported to them that you had done a 23 digital removal and it was believed that might be the 24 cause of the trauma. 25 Kelly Pipkin noted that she had been told by 1940 1 nursing staff that you had disimpacted your mother on 2 Sunday and that there was bright red blood on the sheets 3 of the bed. Lillian Folley stated that you presented 4 with rectal bleeding, and that you -- that rectal 5 bleeding was discovered after you had been witnessed 6 disimpacting her at Sunbelt, and she testified today 7 that, in her mind, that was a cause/effect relationship; 8 in other words, your disimpacting caused her rectal 9 bleeding. And that you also were reported by Lillian 10 Folley to be lying on top of your mother French kissing 11 her and that security was at the bedside asking you to 12 leave. 13 And then upon the admission to Florida 14 Hospital on September 22nd, the documented evidence says 15 presenting complaint, rectal bleeding, protective 16 custody, and that she was being admitted to ORMC for 17 evaluation of questionable sexual abuse between son and 18 mother. A one-on-one sitter was ordered, and HRS was 19 consulted for clarification of guardian status, and that 20 the diagnosis was protection from family members, 21 Alzheimer's. 22 Putting all those things in the record that 23 this jury's heard, what act does that -- in your mind, 24 what conclusions do you draw by what act you were being 25 accused of by those allegations? 1941 1 MS. MARSHALL: Objection, leading. 2 THE COURT: Overruled on that basis. 3 A In my mind, I was being accused of sodomizing 4 my mother. 5 Q I know you said that you don't really know 6 what you did or why you did it, but what act did you end 7 up doing? What reaction did you have to these 8 allegations being made about you? 9 A I felt I was going to jail. Are you talking 10 about when I found out about all these -- 11 Q Yes, sir. 12 A -- from Judy Simms? 13 Q Yes, sir. 14 A I felt like I was going -- I felt that there 15 was an hysteria. I felt that there was a snowball 16 effect. I felt that there was a mob mentality, and I 17 felt I was going straight to jail. I went back to Kay's 18 house, and I went to make the biggest sign. 19 And in my mind, I was not going to sit there, 20 and I was not going to depend on some type of government 21 internal investigation to determine whether all these 22 things were true or not. I got the biggest sign, and I 23 was going to plant it right in front of the hospital and 24 smack them right back in the face. 25 Q Is this the sign? 1942 1 A And show them that I wasn't afraid of anything 2 because it was all a lie. 3 Q Is this the sign, Mr. Destefano? 4 A That's the sign. 5 Q That sign is the sign you used for how many 6 months? 7 A I think it was over a year. 8 Q Since you believe that you were being accused 9 of sodomizing your dying 71-year-old mother, did you 10 think it was proper to call them disgusting perverts? 11 A Yeah, I think that's proper. 12 Q Now, Mr. Destefano, you said that you don't 13 really know what was going on in your head. I want you 14 to be a little more explicit about what was -- during 15 that one year, what was your driving force here? What 16 was causing you to do this picketing in terms of how your 17 emotional state was? 18 A There were a lot of emotional states, 19 Mr. Osborne. There was rage. There was anger. There 20 was dignity. There was honor I wanted restored. There 21 was accountability. There was -- 22 Q Now, you knew at this time that you had two 23 major medical institutions saying these things about you, 24 correct? 25 A I was in a lot of trouble, yes. 1943 1 Q You've heard some testimony about your using 2 some profanity? 3 A Yes. 4 Q Did you use profanity with people? 5 A Yes, I did. 6 Q Did people use profanity with you from Florida 7 Hospital? 8 A Many times. 9 Q Are you proud of how you acted? 10 A No. I'm disgusted with my behavior. 11 Q Why is that? 12 A Because that isn't the way I act. I don't act 13 that way. I'm not that type of individual. I don't talk 14 to people that way. I don't cuss at people. I respect 15 people. 16 Q You weren't very respectful during that year 17 you were picketing, were you? 18 A No, I was not. 19 Q I want to show you what I want to move into 20 evidence. 21 MR. OSBORNE: This is part of the composite, 22 but I'm going to admit it separately. It's 23 Plaintiff's 8 for identification as listed. Any 24 objection? 25 MS. MARSHALL: It's hearsay, Your Honor. 1944 1 THE COURT: Approach the bench. Before you 2 do, lay your foundation. Lay the foundation, then 3 I'll hear your objection. 4 MR. OSBORNE: Certainly. 5 BY MR. OSBORNE: 6 Q Mr. Destefano, is this a letter written by 7 you? 8 A Yes. 9 Q And who's it written to? Give me the category 10 of people it's written to, not all the names. 11 A Adventist Health System, 111 North Orange 12 Avenue, Winter Park, Florida. 13 Q No, don't read it. Just tell me who did you 14 address in this letter? 15 A I sent this letter to Mr. Thomas L. Warner, 16 the president, CEO -- 17 Q Okay. Give me the category. Don't read 18 everybody. How many people was this addressed to? 19 A This was sent to all 12 corporate officers. 20 Q What's the date of it? 21 A August 12th, 2000. 22 Q And authored by you? 23 A Yes. 24 Q All right. 25 MR. OSBORNE: Move it into evidence, Your 1945 1 Honor. 2 MS. MARSHALL: Objection, Your Honor, hearsay. 3 THE COURT: Approach the bench. 4 (Bench conference.) 5 THE COURT: Do you want to be heard on whether 6 it's hearsay, first of all; and if it is, is there 7 an exception? 8 MR. OSBORNE: It's not hearsay. It's his own 9 letter that he wrote. 10 THE COURT: Out-of-court statement. 11 MR. OSBORNE: State of mind at the time. 12 THE COURT: And that's relevant to what? 13 MR. OSBORNE: You have to look at the letter 14 to see what it is, Judge. I've got a copy of it. 15 THE COURT: You haven't laid your foundation 16 yet. All I know is it's a letter, and it's written 17 to Adventist. 18 MR. OSBORNE: Correct. 19 THE COURT: Is that your only response to 20 their hearsay objection? 21 MR. OSBORNE: It's a statement by him, Judge. 22 It's a prior statement by him. It goes to his state 23 of mind at the time, and that's what I'm going to 24 ask him about is his state of mind at the time as to 25 why he's picketing. 1946 1 THE COURT: So the relevance is why he was 2 picketing? 3 MR. OSBORNE: The relevance is, Judge -- I was 4 talking about the hearsay, and you asked me about 5 that. The relevance is -- 6 THE COURT: If you say it goes to his state of 7 mind, how is his stated of mind relevant? 8 MR. OSBORNE: It has to do with what he wanted 9 at that point in terms of why he was picketing. He 10 said he's having difficulty explaining why he's 11 picketing. It's in the letter what his state of 12 mind was as to why he was picketing. We were 13 talking about his picketing in reaction to the 14 allegations that were made, Judge. 15 MS. MARSHALL: Your Honor, it's hearsay. It's 16 his out-of-court statement. 17 THE COURT: Right. 18 MS. MARSHALL: There is no exception. 19 THE COURT: Mr. Osborne says that he's not 20 offering it for the truth of the statement rather 21 his state of mind at the time that being relevant to 22 why he was picketing Florida Hospital. 23 MS. MARSHALL: He can refresh his memory with 24 the portions that deal specifically with the 25 statement. 1947 1 THE COURT: That may be, but that's -- 2 MS. MARSHALL: It would only be portions that 3 would be admissible for that purpose and the other 4 portions would not. 5 THE COURT: Okay. Well, maybe I better see it 6 then. 7 MR. OSBORNE: I've got it here, Judge. 8 MS. MARSHALL: Here's my copy. 9 (Open court.) 10 THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, why don't we 11 take a brief recess of, say, five or ten minutes. I 12 have something to address with the lawyers, and 13 we'll get back to you as soon as possible. Please 14 don't go downstairs, however. 15 THE COURT DEPUTY: All rise for the jury. 16 THE WITNESS: Your Honor, may I use the 17 restroom, please? 18 THE COURT: Yeah, go ahead, sure. 19 (Jury exits.) 20 THE COURT: (Reviewing document.) 21 Mr. Osborne, the hearsay objection is sustained. 22 You may use that for purposes of refreshing the 23 witness's recollection. Court will be in brief 24 recess. 25 (A 6-minute recess was had.) 1948 1 MR. OSBORNE: I would like to attach this 2 letter as a proffer. 3 THE COURT: You have it marked for 4 identification, don't you? 5 MR. OSBORNE: Not individually. It's in the 6 composite exhibit. Can I get that that's a 7 sufficient proffer without me having to publish it? 8 THE COURT: If it's marked for identification, 9 it's going to be in your appellate record. 10 MR. OSBORNE: Okay. 11 THE COURT: So that would be the next numbered 12 exhibit for identification for the plaintiff. 13 MS. MARSHALL: A lettered exhibit, not a 14 number. 15 THE COURT: Yes, letter exhibit. It's not 16 being admitted. 17 THE CLERK: Plaintiff's ID AM. 18 (Jury enters.) 19 BY MR. OSBORNE: 20 Q Mr. Destefano. 21 A Yes. 22 Q While you were picketing, did you have any 23 communications with the corporate structure or people 24 within Florida Hospital? 25 A Yes, I did. 1949 1 Q And did you tell them what it is that you were 2 upset about? 3 A Yes, I did. 4 Q What'd you tell them? 5 A I outlined all the defamatory statements that 6 were made against me, the sexual allegations that I was 7 engaged in towards my mother. 8 Q And did you tell them what you wanted -- 9 A Yes. 10 Q -- to stop you picketing? What'd you tell 11 them? 12 A Who I called or just what I told them? 13 Q Generally, what did you tell them you were 14 wanting in terms of what did you want Florida Hospital to 15 do. 16 A I wanted them to sit down and meet with me so 17 we could discuss this. I asked the president of the 18 company -- I made phone calls. They said they would 19 return my phone calls, but they never returned my phone 20 calls. And all I told them was that I just wanted to sit 21 down, and I wanted them to just have a meeting with me so 22 that we could discuss this and I could explain what the 23 situation was and let them do their own internal 24 investigation and find out what happened. 25 Q Did you tell them you wanted money? 1950 1 A No. 2 Q What'd you tell them you wanted? 3 A I told them that I just wanted to have a 4 meeting so that we could discuss this and sit down. 5 Q Did you feel that a wrong had been done here? 6 A Yes, I did. 7 Q Did you tell them what you wanted to be done 8 about that wrong? 9 A I told them I wasn't looking to get even. I 10 said this wasn't an eye for an eye. All I told them was 11 that I wasn't angry, and my only objective was that I 12 wanted to right a wrong and make sure this never ever 13 happened again. 14 Q How tall are you, Mr. Destefano? 15 A I'm six-two. 16 Q Would you stand up and come on down and stand 17 in front of the jury, please? 18 MR. OSBORNE: Marjorie, Neal, would you come 19 forward, please? Stand right here in front of the 20 jury, if you would. 21 MS. MARSHALL: Your Honor, I object to this. 22 MR. TOWNSEND: Your Honor, can we approach? 23 THE COURT: Counsel approach the bench. 24 (Bench conference.) 25 MS. MARSHALL: This is theatrics. 1951 1 MR. OSBORNE: This is a -- 2 THE COURT: What are you going to do? 3 MR. OSBORNE: I'm going to say this is woman 4 about the size and height and weight of your mother 5 and have her stand next to him, and that's all I'm 6 going to do, Judge. 7 THE COURT: That's relevant to what? 8 MR. OSBORNE: The credibility of the 9 allegations that he was lying on top of his mother. 10 MS. MARSHALL: This person is not on the 11 witness list, and he withdrew his doll and bed 12 exhibits -- 13 MR. OSBORNE: Doesn't have to be on the 14 witness list. 15 MS. MARSHALL: -- saying they were not going 16 to be -- they weren't going to do that. 17 MR. TOWNSEND: I think it's prejudicial, and 18 it's a show to bring this crippled lady up here. 19 THE COURT: Overruled. Go ahead. 20 (Open court.) 21 MR. OSBORNE: Marjorie, come forward, please. 22 Face the jury, if you would, please, Mrs. Gill. 23 BY MR. OSBORNE: 24 Q Now, Mr. Destefano, is Marjorie Gill about the 25 same height as your mother? 1952 1 A I would say so, yes. 2 Q Is she about the approximate weight of your 3 mother? 4 A I would say so, yes. 5 MR. OSBORNE: Thank you, Mrs. Gill. You may 6 return to your chair. Thank you, Mr. Destefano. 7 Q Let me go back and cover one point we didn't 8 talk about during your mother's hospitalization at any of 9 these facilities, whether it was Florida Hospital or 10 whether it was Sunbelt nursing home or whether it was 11 Orlando Regional. In terms of your mother's right heel 12 wound, is that bleeding actively at any time during any 13 of the time she was in these hospitals? 14 A That was not bleeding. That heel wound was 15 clear. It was crusted. It had a scab on it. There was 16 no blood coming from that heel, not at all. 17 Q And in terms of -- 18 A There was no sanguinous fluid. There was 19 nothing. It was clean. 20 Q Mr. Destefano, in terms of this incontinence 21 pad, what part of your mother's body was this pad under? 22 A The middle of the pad was exactly underneath 23 my mother's buttocks at all time. 24 Q And where would her heel have been, her feet 25 have been? 1953 1 A In relation to the pad? 2 Q Yeah. 3 A Her feet would have been -- 4 Q Off the pad? 5 A Of course, right by the length of the -- femur 6 and the -- 7 Q All right. Now, during the course of your 8 picketing for that year, were you arrested? 9 A Yes, I was. 10 Q And how many times were you arrested? 11 A I would say two or three times. I can't 12 recall. I'm pretty sure on two -- I know two occasions I 13 was arrested. 14 Q Did you have -- at some point in time, did you 15 have a video camera out there? 16 A Yes, I did. 17 MR. OSBORNE: This is part of Defendants' 18 Exhibit U. 19 Q Can you identify this document, Mr. Destefano? 20 A Yes, I can. 21 Q What is that? 22 A That's an order of dismissal. 23 Q As to one of your arrests for picketing? 24 A I think there was one more for another arrest, 25 but yes. 1954 1 Q And this is State of Florida versus Larry M. 2 Destefano? 3 A Yes. 4 MR. OSBORNE: I would move it into evidence, 5 Your Honor. 6 MS. MARSHALL: No objection. 7 MR. TOWNSEND: No objection. 8 (Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 23 was admitted.) 9 MR. OSBORNE: Your Honor, I'd like to publish 10 this to the jury. This is an Order of Dismissal 11 dated September 6, 2000. The State and Defense have 12 jointly proffered for judicial notice the 13 depositions of the state civilian witnesses and a 14 videotape of the incident made by the defendant. 15 The Defense and the State have asked the Court 16 to rule on the defense's oral motion to dismiss 17 pursuant to Florida Rule of Civil Procedure 18 3.190(c)(4). The Court has reviewed the evidence 19 submitted and hereby finds that as a matter of law, 20 the evidence in this case will not support a 21 judgment of guilt. 22 The legal principles are controlled by the 23 United States Supreme Court decision of City of 24 Houston v. Hill, 482 U.S. 451 (1987). The facts of 25 this case are similar to the facts in Hill; whereas, 1955 1 in both cases, the defendant was verbally 2 challenging police authority. In Hill, the Supreme 3 Court stated that: 4 The freedom of individuals verbally to oppose 5 or challenge police action without thereby risking 6 arrest is one of the principal characteristics by 7 which we distinguish a free nation from a police 8 state. Id. at 462-63. 9 Speech is often provocative and challenging 10 but it is nevertheless protected against censorship 11 or punishment unless shown likely to produce a clear 12 and present danger of serious substantive evil that 13 rises far above public inconvenience, annoyance and 14 arrest. 15 In Hill, the Supreme Court distinguished the 16 cases involving verbal opposition to the police from 17 those involving physical opposition to the police. 18 However, there was no physical opposition present in 19 this case. 20 Wherefore, this case is hereby dismissed 21 pursuant to Florida Rule of Criminal Procedure 22 3.190(c)(4). Done and ordered this 6th day of 23 September in chambers at Orlando, Orange County, 24 Florida, Deb Sammons Blechman, County Judge. 25 BY MR. OSBORNE: 1956 1 Q Now, Mr. Destefano, the other time you were 2 arrested, was it similarly dismissed as this one was? 3 A Yes, it was. 4 Q Were you also given citations? 5 A Yes, I was. 6 Q By whom? 7 A By the City of Orlando, the code enforcement 8 department. 9 Q And what did the code enforcement department 10 cite you for? 11 A They said that -- first they said that I 12 wasn't allowed to picket without a permit, and I just 13 ignored that response. And then they came back and they 14 cited me for -- they gave me a citation for having a 15 permanent sign, that I wasn't allowed to have a permanent 16 sign. 17 Q What'd you do then? 18 A I went -- oh, they said because my sign was on 19 the ground on the right-of-way that that was considered a 20 permanent sign, and so I went out to Wal-Mart, and I 21 bought a cheap pair of steel-toed boots so that I could 22 place the sign on top of the steel toes in the boot so 23 that they couldn't say it was a permanent planted sign. 24 It was too heavy for me to hold up. 25 Q After you had been picketing for a 1957 1 considerable period of time, were you approached by John 2 Amick, who was head of security with Florida Hospital? 3 A Yes, I was. 4 Q Was this towards the end of the time that you 5 were picketing that he approached you? 6 A Yes, it was. 7 Q What conversation did you have with Mr. Amick 8 about your picketing? 9 A He came up to me and -- he came up right next 10 to me, and he was smiling. I remember him being head of 11 security at Florida Hospital. And he leaned towards me, 12 and he said -- he was joking. He said, Larry, why don't 13 you put this in the appropriate forum? I said, what are 14 you talking about? He said, come on, why don't you do 15 this right? Why don't you put it in the appropriate 16 forum? I said I didn't know what he was talking about. 17 He said, why don't you sue us? That was the 18 conversation. 19 Q Is that the first time you'd ever thought 20 about suing Florida Hospital and Orlando Regional Medical 21 Center? 22 A That's the first time I ever thought about 23 suing them. 24 Q Did you yourself try to get satisfaction? You 25 talked about you had written letters to Florida Hospital 1958 1 officials. Had you written letters to other folks too? 2 A I wrote letters to Florida Hospital. I went 3 up to the executive offices. I begged and pleaded them 4 to meet with me. I went to the executive offices at 5 Bedford Rollins. I went to the executive offices on the 6 eleventh floor of Florida Hospital. I went down to the 7 executive offices at Winter Park by Houston's. I went to 8 the state ombudsman. I went to the Agency for Health 9 Care Administration. 10 Q Did you go to Orlando Regional? 11 A I went to the Orlando Regional risk management 12 department. I spoke to -- I have their names in my 13 binder there. I spoke to two of their representatives 14 who said they would call me back. They never called me 15 back. I would call them. 16 I went down to the hospital. They told me not 17 to come. They said if I had a grievance that I needed to 18 file a civil suit. 19 I went to risk management at Florida Hospital. 20 They told me if I was unhappy with them to file a civil 21 suit. I went to the police department, OPD. I wanted to 22 file a false report with them. I said -- I told them, I 23 said, if you look at the record, there was Connie 24 Standish saying that these nurses were going to set me 25 up. I said, if you go talk to her, she'll tell you the 1959 1 names of the people who did this, and these are all false 2 reports. I said, if you would just investigate it, you 3 would see the evidence. 4 And everyone told me that this is a civil 5 matter. You need to just sue them if you want any 6 justice. 7 Q Let me ask you, Mr. Destefano, talking about 8 your OPD report -- 9 A Yes. 10 Q Identify what this next document is, please. 11 I'll represent it was Exhibit 23 -- no, it's not 23, but 12 this is a listed exhibit. Do you recognize that 13 document? 14 A Yes. 15 Q What is it? 16 A It's a document that I went to Detective 17 O'Hern, who was with the sex crimes unit, that Officer 18 Padilla was talking about earlier. 19 MR. OSBORNE: I'd like to move this into 20 evidence. 21 MS. MARSHALL: No objection. 22 THE CLERK: The last one -- I need the last 23 one also. 24 THE COURT: What numbers are these? 25 THE CLERK: This one -- I'm getting ready to 1960 1 mark 23 and 24. 2 (Plaintiff's Exhibit No. 24 was admitted.) 3 THE COURT: No objection to these exhibits? 4 MS. MARSHALL: No objection. 5 MR. TOWNSEND: No objection. 6 MR. OSBORNE: Is this 24, Madam Clerk? 7 THE CLERK: Yes. 8 BY MR. OSBORNE: 9 Q Mr. Destefano, on Exhibit 24, you mentioned 10 this is your report to OPD? 11 A Yes. 12 Q And tell the jury -- read to the jury the two 13 last paragraphs of this document. 14 A It says "case narrative," and the last two 15 paragraphs state: Destefano stated that he has been 16 wrongfully and maliciously accused; therefore, is filing 17 this report reference false allegations. Destefano 18 stated that he has factual documentation to support his 19 statements. Destefano was instructed by Investigator 20 Thomas that this incident is deemed civil, and he should 21 contact an attorney to assist him further. 22 Q Is that what you did? 23 A It's the only thing I could do, yes. 24 Q Now, this case has been going on for how many 25 years, Mr. Destefano? 1961 1 A Six years. 2 Q And in the course of this litigation, 3 initially did you have difficulty finding people to 4 believe you? 5 A As far as finding an attorney? 6 Q Let's start with that. 7 MS. MARSHALL: Objection, Your Honor, 8 relevance. 9 THE COURT: Mr. Osborne? 10 MR. OSBORNE: I'll withdraw the question. 11 BY MR. OSBORNE: 12 Q Mr. Destefano, during the course of this 13 lawsuit, have you -- what role have you taken in trying 14 to prove up your case during the investigation of this -- 15 this lawsuit and suing? 16 A No one believed -- no one believed the 17 circumstances. No one believed what I had to say. I had 18 to gather all the evidence myself. I don't understand -- 19 I don't -- 20 Q You've answered the question. And in the 21 course of this litigation, have you been trying to find 22 witnesses to these facts? 23 A Of course, yes. 24 Q Have you gone to people's houses? 25 A I think I went to two homes, yes. 1962 1 Q Have you called witnesses on the phone? 2 A Yes. 3 Q Have you ever misidentified yourself other 4 than someone as Larry Destefano? 5 A I think once I did. 6 Q Who did you say you were? 7 A Maybe Jim Davis. 8 Q And who was that that you gave that 9 information to? 10 A I think that was Kelly Pipkin when I went down 11 to her house with my other investigator. 12 Q Why did you tell her your name was Jim Davis, 13 not Larry Destefano? 14 A If I told her my name was Larry Destefano, she 15 wouldn't even talk to me. I was the one she was accusing 16 of sexually molesting my mother. 17 Q Mr. Destefano, let's talk about you. Before 18 these incidents that occurred -- let me strike that. 19 How would you describe your relationship with 20 your mother, how you felt about her during her lifetime 21 and particularly during the twilight of her lifetime? 22 A She was the love of my life. 23 Q And during the course of time that you were 24 trespassed initially from Florida Hospital and then we 25 had the one-on-one sitter, were you ever able to be alone 1963 1 with your mother again? 2 A No, I wasn't, not until I got -- when I got 3 her back home before she went into hospice. But when I 4 got her back home alone, I was alone with her, but I was 5 never -- I was never left alone with my mother again 6 whenever she was in the hospital setting. 7 Q What is it that concerns you in terms of these 8 allegations being made about you and your mother? What 9 is it about those allegations and your relationship with 10 your mother? Describe for the jury what that has done to 11 you. 12 A Please rephrase the question, Mr. Osborne. 13 Q That's fine. We're talking about these 14 allegations that we've been talking to the jury about for 15 the last six days. 16 A Yes. 17 Q What was the effect of those allegations upon 18 you and how you view your relationship with your mother 19 and how you felt about your mother and how that's 20 affected you? 21 A Physically, emotionally, mentally? 22 Q Let's start globally. 23 A Globally? 24 Q Right. 25 A I don't know the -- 1964 1 Q Let me start this way. Mr. Destefano, in 2 terms of what they accused you of that we've talked about 3 here, in your mind, is there anything worse they could 4 have accused you of? 5 A No. 6 Q Why not? 7 A That was my being, my mother, my dignity, that 8 was my honor, my reputation. This was my reputation. 9 This was my family. This was my -- they were accusing me 10 of doing these things to -- this is what I was all about. 11 This is -- 12 Q What is family and your mother to you? What 13 was that? What is that you said that's what you're all 14 about? How did that interrelate? 15 A That's my honor. That's my honor. That's -- 16 Q When you first heard these allegations, the 17 ones I published to you, when you first heard these 18 allegations, what was your physical reaction to these 19 allegations? 20 A I know that I became nauseous a few times. I 21 know that I threw up a couple of times. I know that I 22 was enraged. I know that I would rather you put a gun to 23 my head and shoot me than accuse me of sexually molesting 24 my mother. My mother was dying. I mean, I don't know 25 what -- I don't know what to say. 1965 1 Q And you had just spent eight months of intense 2 caregiving to her, too, had you not? 3 A Yes, yes. She was my mother. She was -- 4 Q In terms of this emotional -- you said you 5 were nauseous. Has that nauseous feeling ever left you 6 since these allegations were made about you? 7 A Yeah, the nauseousness left me. That 8 sickening feeling, no, that hasn't left me. The gnawing 9 in my stomach, the rage that runs through me, no, that 10 hasn't left me, no. The rage will always be there. The 11 rage is there. The anger is there. I was just accused 12 of -- 13 Q You said sodomizing your mother is what you 14 told the jury, correct? 15 A Yes. 16 Q How has your life changed since these 17 allegations were made against you? 18 A I don't care about my life anymore. 19 Q What do you mean? 20 A I don't care about life. I don't care about 21 anything. I don't care what happens. I don't care. 22 Q What's your reason for living? 23 A There is no reason for living. 24 Q What are you doing here in the courtroom? 25 A I want to make sure this never happens again. 1966 1 I want to make sure they know what they did, and I want 2 to make sure they pay for what they did. And all I 3 wanted to do was have a meeting with them. All I wanted 4 them to do was talk to me and apologize. 5 All I wanted them to do was fire the nurses 6 who did this. I didn't want them to do this. I asked 7 them to do an in-house investigation. I pleaded with 8 them. I said, please, why don't you do your in-house 9 investigation, and you'll find out what happened. And 10 when you find out, fire the nurses, fire the nurses, 11 issue an apology to the Orlando Police Department, 12 apologize to them, tell them I didn't do what I did. 13 I wanted ORMC to do the same thing. I pleaded 14 and begged with them. They laughed at me. Their risk 15 manager, Frances Wiegand, that was in here, I was in a 16 meeting with her. I begged and pleaded with her. She 17 folded her arms, laughed, and she said, huh, is that all 18 you have -- 19 MS. MARSHALL: Objection, Your Honor. That's 20 not responsive to the question. 21 MR. OSBORNE: The question was why are you 22 here. 23 THE COURT: Overruled. 24 BY MR. OSBORNE: 25 Q Go ahead and finish your answer, sir. 1967 1 A I was with my girlfriend. I asked to have a 2 meeting with Frances Wiegand. We sat in the room. I 3 begged with her. I said, please, would you go to your 4 executives? We can resolve this. Once you find out what 5 happened -- I even told them if they investigated and 6 came to the conclusion that I did do this, they didn't 7 have to apologize, but just investigate, at least put 8 some time into it, because the nurse -- 9 I apologize. I said there was a nurse over 10 there. I said talk to the nurses, you'll find out that 11 this is all untrue. There was no rectal bleeding. There 12 was none of this going on, and they just ignored me. Go 13 get a lawyer. Go sue us. Go put it in the appropriate 14 forum. 15 Q Let me ask you this. In terms of your 16 physicality, the things you used to do physically before 17 these events and then after, describe for the jury what 18 that is. 19 A I played tennis about five days a week. I was 20 an avid runner. I put in about 20, 30 miles a week, ran 21 on weekends, went out to dinner with my girlfriend, went 22 to the movies, Winter Park Village. We used to go 23 places. We just used to go out to the park. We'd drive 24 out to the beach. Is this the before? Are we talking 25 after? 1968 1 Q Talking before, first. 2 A Just normal things people did every day, 3 walked around Lake Eola. 4 Q What do you do now? 5 A I stay at home. 6 Q What do you spend your time on every day in 7 the last six years? 8 A I think I spent my time -- I think I pace. 9 They say I pace a lot. People say I pace. 10 Q What about you emotionally, what were you like 11 before these events of September 1999? 12 A I don't know what I was like. I know what 13 people have told me I was like, and I know people always 14 regarded me as a gentleman. I think people always 15 regarded me as someone -- I was always welcome to parties 16 with friends. People liked having me around. I knew 17 that people respected me. I know people knew I did good 18 work because I had a large customer base. I knew I did 19 good work, and I felt like I was well liked. 20 Q Has this -- well, let me ask you this. What 21 do you like now? How do people react to you now and what 22 do you hear about yourself since September of 1999? 23 A I suspect if I don't like myself, people don't 24 like me. 25 Q This feeling you have, has this been 1969 1 continuing since the time these allegations were made? 2 A Every minute of the day every single day of my 3 life. 4 Q Has that feeling -- is that a stressful 5 feeling you've got? 6 A It's stress. It's panic, anxiety. 7 Q What do you mean anxiety? What do you talk 8 about when you say anxiety? 9 A I feel I have these panic attacks sometimes. 10 I have these times that I don't want to think about. I 11 have to -- I spend a great deal of time trying to control 12 myself. I don't think -- I don't think it takes a rocket 13 scientist to understand when you're accused falsely of 14 sexually molesting your mother when she's on her death 15 bed what that will do to you inside as a person. They 16 took away the most sanctimonious holy thing that I had 17 with my mother. This was my mom. 18 Q Do you have nightmares? 19 A Yes, I have nightmares. 20 Q Do you have any physical ailments because of 21 this stress? 22 A I think I do. 23 Q What are your physical ailments? 24 A My stomach's in pain. I feel the pain that 25 shoots through my back. My chest hurts. I feel pain 1970 1 going down my arm. 2 Q Have you been to a doctor for any of these 3 things? 4 A I won't go to a doctor. 5 Q Why not? 6 A Because I won't go to a hospital. 7 Q Why not? 8 A Because I'm afraid of hospitals. 9 Q What about your relationship with Kay, who 10 testified in here, how has that changed or has that 11 changed since the incidents of September 1999? 12 A Yes, that's changed. 13 Q In what way? 14 A There's no love there. I mean, I don't -- I 15 don't -- there's no intimacy. There's no emotion. I 16 don't give her any attention. I don't -- 17 Q Do you still love her? 18 A I don't treat her -- sure I do. 19 Q Well, how do you treat her now? How do you 20 feel about the relationship now? 21 A I just don't treat her the way she should be 22 treated, the way I used to treat her. I don't treat 23 anyone the way I used to treat them. 24 Q Mr. Destefano, if you could sum up, as best 25 you can, in one paragraph or one sentence of how these 1971 1 events have affected you, these events of September of 2 1999, how would you say it? 3 A I would say they destroyed my life. They 4 destroyed me physically. They destroyed me emotionally. 5 I wish I could walk outside right now and get hit by a 6 bus and just be done by it. And I really don't even want 7 to be here. I don't want to live here. I don't even 8 want to be on this planet. I just don't even want to be 9 alive. 10 MR. OSBORNE: No further questions. 11 THE COURT: Cross-examine? 12 MS. MARSHALL: Yes. May I just have a couple 13 moments, Your Honor, to get organized? 14 THE COURT: Stand up and stretch, ladies and 15 gentlemen. 16 THE WITNESS: Do you mind if I use the 17 restroom, Your Honor? 18 THE COURT: Go ahead, Mr. Destefano. You all 19 okay? Let's take about five minutes, ladies and 20 gentlemen. Take the jury out, please, come back in 21 five minutes. 22 THE COURT DEPUTY: All rise for the jury. 23 (Jury exits.) 24 MR. OSBORNE: I've got two quick witnesses 25 just in case, but Ms. Marshall said there is no 1972 1 chance I'm going to finish today. 2 THE COURT: I don't know. What do you mean? 3 You're going to go until 6:00? 4 MS. MARSHALL: I would guess. I don't know. 5 I haven't timed it, so if you want to -- 6 THE COURT: I expect we'll go until -- well -- 7 MR. OSBORNE: I can keep them hanging around, 8 Judge. That's okay. If I don't have to, I can have 9 them come first thing in the morning. 10 THE COURT: And then you're going to put Krop 11 on and then you're finished? 12 MR. OSBORNE: Correct. 13 THE COURT: Just have them come back in the 14 morning. 15 (A 4-minute recess was had.) 16 THE COURT: Bring in the jury. 17 (Jury enters.) 18 THE COURT: Be seated. Cross-examine, 19 Ms. Marshall. 20 - - - - - 21 CROSS-EXAMINATION 22 BY MS. MARSHALL: 23 Q Good afternoon, Mr. Destefano. 24 A Good afternoon. 25 Q Tell us how you pronounce your name. I've 1973 1 heard that you pronounce it -- well, there are three 2 different ways; is that correct? 3 A Correct. 4 Q And can you tell us what those three are? 5 A Destefano, Destefano. 6 Q So I'm not insulting you if I say one 7 pronunciation or the other? 8 A No, ma'am. 9 Q Okay. Thank you. Now, Mr. Destefano, the 10 Department of Children and Family Services did an 11 investigation into the allegations against you, and they 12 found that you had not abused your mother, correct? 13 A Correct, yes, ma'am. 14 Q And the -- 15 A They were unfounded. The allegations were 16 unfounded. 17 Q Correct. And the Orlando Police Department, 18 we heard Officer Padilla here today, they also concluded 19 that no crime had been committed, correct? 20 A That's correct. The sex crimes unit said no 21 crime was committed. 22 Q And that was actually before they had even 23 interviewed you, right? 24 A Correct. 25 Q And the two arrests that you had talked about, 1974 1 those had to do with your picketing activities, not with 2 any kind of allegations of any kind of sexual misconduct; 3 is that correct? 4 A No, that's not correct. 5 Q You were arrested two times for disorderly 6 conduct, correct? 7 A Correct. 8 Q And you were not arrested anytime for being a 9 sexual perpetrator, were you? 10 A No, I was not, correct. 11 Q And the Department of Children and Family 12 Services also did a report that there had not been any 13 false reporting by the nurses, correct? 14 MR. OSBORNE: Let me object, Your Honor. 15 A No, that's not correct. 16 THE COURT: Your objection is? 17 MR. OSBORNE: Your Honor, I need to approach 18 on this. 19 (Bench conference.) 20 THE COURT: Let me just -- 21 MR. OSBORNE: Judge, all the records you kept 22 out are all the DCFS records. How can I 23 cross-examine on that. She's asking about the 24 comments -- 25 THE COURT: That's hearsay. 1975 1 MR. OSBORNE: Hearsay. 2 MS. MARSHALL: I'm just asking whether they 3 did it or not. 4 THE COURT: Sustained. 5 (Open court.) 6 BY MS. MARSHALL: 7 Q And, Mr. Destefano, when you arrived in 8 Orlando with your mother, she had bedsores on her coccyx 9 area and on her heels, correct? 10 A That's correct. 11 Q And you had been taking care of her for about 12 eight months prior in Arizona except for a two- or 13 three-week period when you came back here to shut down 14 your business, correct? 15 A That's correct, yes, ma'am. 16 Q And you don't have any formal training in 17 physical therapy, do you? 18 A Define formal training, ma'am. Do I have a 19 license in physical therapy? 20 Q Do you have any formal training in physical 21 therapy? 22 A Please define formal training for me, please. 23 I mean, are you asking did I go to school for it? Did I 24 get a license for it? 25 Q Mr. Destefano, you've had your deposition 1976 1 taken in numerous cases or numerous times in this case, 2 have you not? 3 A Yes, I have. 4 Q And before you answered any questions, you 5 were given instructions about to let the lawyer know if 6 you didn't understand any question, right? 7 A Okay. I won't dispute that. 8 Q Okay. And before you answered any questions, 9 you raised your right hand and were sworn by the court 10 reporter to tell the truth, correct? 11 A That's correct. 12 Q Let me -- let me show you your deposition 13 dated February 19th, 2002. And if you would, sir, if you 14 could turn to page 259, line 17 to 22, and see if that 15 refreshes your memory about whether you have had any -- 16 A (Reviewing transcript.) It does. 17 Q And the answer is? 18 A No. 19 Q Thank you. And you don't have any formal 20 medical training either, do you? 21 A No. 22 Q And, in fact, you haven't attended high 23 school? 24 A No, I have not. 25 Q Or junior high? 1977 1 A No, I have not. 2 Q And you don't believe that you ever completed 3 the sixth grade, correct? 4 A I don't ever recall going to school, no. 5 Q So you never completed the sixth grade? 6 A Correct. 7 Q And you don't believe that you've ever 8 completed any grade of school, correct? 9 A Correct. 10 Q Now, you talked about your -- 11 A I did find a junior high school diploma, 12 though. 13 Q You did? 14 A Just recently, yeah. 15 Q You talked about your service in the United 16 States Navy, correct? 17 A Correct. 18 Q And when you were in the Navy, did you have to 19 fill out an application? 20 A Yes, I did. 21 Q Let me just show you that. And did you tell 22 the Navy that you had completed up until the eleventh 23 grade of school? 24 MR. OSBORNE: Object, hearsay. 25 MS. MARSHALL: I'm asking him if he told -- 1978 1 MR. OSBORNE: Approach the bench. 2 THE WITNESS: I have no problem answering the 3 question. 4 THE COURT: Mr. Destefano, just let the lawyer 5 make the argument. 6 (Bench conference.) 7 THE COURT: This is a hearsay objection 8 about -- she's not introducing the document. 9 MS. MARSHALL: Correct. 10 THE COURT: Do you have an objection to the 11 question about what he told the Navy? 12 MR. OSBORNE: As long as he's not looking at 13 the document when he answers the question. 14 THE COURT: He can refresh his recollection 15 with a dead possum on the road. 16 MR. OSBORNE: Judge, to properly refresh it, 17 he has to be asked does that refresh your 18 recollection. 19 MS. MARSHALL: I haven't gotten there yet. 20 THE COURT: Overruled for now. 21 (Open court.) 22 BY MS. MARSHALL: 23 Q Mr. Destefano, did you tell the U.S. Navy that 24 you had completed eleven grades of school? 25 A You want me to read you the document to come 1979 1 to that conclusion? 2 Q Well, if that will help you refresh your 3 memory, yes, please do that. 4 A Tell me what page I should look at, ma'am, and 5 that will make it much faster. What page would you like 6 me to look at to refresh my memory? 7 Q Okay. On page -- I think if you look on 8 page 2. 9 A Yes. It says, education, year and month, from 10 9/75 to 12/77, JFK High School, Guam. 11 Q And, in fact, did you ever attend JFK High 12 School in Guam? 13 A Maybe for a day. 14 Q So you had not -- you didn't attend during 15 those years that you had indicated on there; is that 16 correct? 17 MR. OSBORNE: Judge, this is cross-examination 18 of the document now. I'm going to object as 19 hearsay. 20 THE COURT: Overruled. 21 A So 9/75 would be the ninth month of 1975 to 22 December of 1977? 23 Q Right. Were you in school then? 24 A No. 25 Q Okay. So that was an inaccurate application 1980 1 to the United States government, wasn't it? 2 A Wait a second. It said did you graduate. I 3 said no. 4 Q You had said that you were not in -- that you 5 don't ever remember attending school, correct? 6 A Correct. 7 Q So that when you stated on your application 8 that you had gone to JFK High School in Guam from '75 to 9 '77, that was not true, was it? 10 A It's not saying that I went to high school 11 from '77 -- I mean, I don't want to get into a bickering 12 contest, but when I filled this out, I was just under the 13 assumption they were asking what years I would have went 14 to JFK High School. I put the year down, and then I 15 said, no, I did not graduate because I didn't go to 16 school. I mean -- 17 Q So you thought that when they were asking you 18 for your educational background, the name and location of 19 school, that they were asking you what school you would 20 have gone to had you gone to school? 21 A You know what, Ms. Marshall? It says '75 to 22 12/77 JFK High School, it says no. You're asking me did 23 I go through those dates? Is that what you're asking me, 24 did I go through the date I listed here? Are you asking 25 me did I go to school from 9/75 to 12/77? 1981 1 Q At JFK High School in Guam. 2 A Is that what you're asking me? 3 Q Correct? 4 A No, I did not. 5 Q And can you turn to the last page of the 6 document -- 7 A Yes. 8 Q -- under "Certification"? 9 A Yes. 10 Q Can you read what that says, please? 11 MR. OSBORNE: Your Honor, again, this is a 12 document not in evidence. 13 MS. MARSHALL: I can re-call him, Your Honor. 14 It's his application. It's his statement. He 15 signed it. 16 THE COURT: Approach the bench. 17 (Bench conference.) 18 THE COURT: Your question for him is about the 19 statements he made on this document, and there's no 20 question pending. Where are you going with this? 21 MS. MARSHALL: Well, Your Honor, he's taken an 22 oath at the end of it that it is true, and he's 23 testified that he's never attended a school a day in 24 his life, so he signed a document for the United 25 States government that is false. 1982 1 THE COURT: This is a sworn document? 2 MS. MARSHALL: Yes, it is. Yes, it is. 3 THE COURT: And your objection is? 4 MR. OSBORNE: The document's not in evidence. 5 It's hearsay. 6 THE COURT: But she can cross-examine him 7 using the document. 8 MR. OSBORNE: She wants him to read from the 9 document. He didn't draft that language. 10 THE COURT: I don't know that she's not asking 11 him to read. 12 MR. OSBORNE: She asked him to read. 13 THE COURT: No, that's not the last question. 14 Overruled. 15 (Open court.) 16 BY MS. MARSHALL: 17 Q Mr. Destefano, can you turn to the last page 18 under "Certification"? 19 A I'm there, ma'am. 20 Q And did you take an oath that the information 21 given by you in the document was true and complete, to 22 the best of your knowledge? 23 A In order to accept my enlistment, is that what 24 you're saying? Under "Certification" where it says: I 25 understand the Armed Forces representative who will 1983 1 accept my enlistment does so in reliance on the 2 information provided by me in this document, and that any 3 information knowingly false or incorrect, that I may be 4 prosecuted under federal civilian or military law or 5 subject to administrative proceedings? Is that what 6 you're asking me? 7 Q Yes. 8 A I signed under it, yes, I did. 9 Q So you took an oath that all the information 10 that you had provided in the document was true and 11 correct? 12 A Yes, I did. 13 Q And in the document, it states that your -- 14 that you went -- attended, under the education, JFK High, 15 correct, on page 2? 16 A Ma'am -- 17 Q JFK High, Guam? 18 A Ma'am, I lied, yes. If that's what you're 19 getting at, yes. 20 Q Okay. Thank you. 21 A You're welcome. 22 Q Now, you brought your mother to Florida 23 Hospital on September 15th, correct, 1999? 24 A That's correct. 25 Q And were you living at Kay's house at the time 1984 1 that you took your mother to the hospital? 2 A No, I was not. 3 Q Okay. Where were you living? 4 A I was staying in a hotel. 5 Q Can you turn to page 58 of your -- I'm sorry. 6 Yeah, page 58 of your deposition? 7 A Volume 2? 8 Q Volume 2. And on line 13 through 17, the 9 question was asked of you: 10 "How long did you live at 1130 Guernsy? 11 "Answer: I still live there periodically off 12 and on. 13 "Question: How long did your mother live 14 there? 15 "Answer: My mother stayed there until I 16 brought her to the hospital, Florida Hospital." 17 Do you see that testimony? 18 A I can't look at that testimony, Ms. Marshall, 19 because I think that would be in Volume 1. 20 Q No, it's in Volume 2, Mr. Destefano. Turn to 21 page 258. 22 A I thought you said 58. I'm sorry. 23 Q I'm sorry, 258. 24 A Yes, ma'am. Go ahead. What line? 25 Q Line 13. 1985 1 A Yes. Would you like -- 2 Q Actually, it's line 9 to 17. 3 A Would you like me to read it to myself or 4 publish it? 5 Q You can read it to yourself. 6 A (Reviewing transcript.) Okay. And the 7 question again, please. 8 Q Well, in your deposition, didn't you state 9 that you were living with Kay at the time that you took 10 your mother to the hospital, not at a hotel? 11 A I was living with Kay, yes. 12 Q And your mother was living with Kay? 13 A Yes. 14 Q So you weren't living at a hotel? 15 A Yes, I was. I was living at the Courtyard 16 Marriott. 17 Q So you were living both places at once? 18 A Yes, I was. I wanted to be closer to my 19 mother; and therefore, I stayed right at the Courtyard 20 Marriott. 21 Q Sir, I'm talking about on -- at the time that 22 you brought your mother to the hospital on September 23 15th, 1999 -- 24 A Yes. 25 Q -- were you living in a hotel or living at 1986 1 Kay's? 2 A I was living at Kay's and also living at the 3 hotel. I could go to Kay's house, and I also was at the 4 Courtyard Marriott. The records are there. You can 5 check them out. I was living at both places. 6 Q And your mother was living at Kay's, correct? 7 A Correct. 8 Q While you were at the hotel? 9 A No, no. My mother was -- why are you -- 10 what's so humorous about that, ma'am? I was staying with 11 my mother at Kay's house, and then I brought my mother to 12 the hospital, and I stayed at the Courtyard Marriott. 13 Q I want to be real clear with my question 14 because I don't mean to confuse you. 15 A Yes. 16 Q Right before you took your mother to the 17 hospital -- 18 A Yes. 19 Q -- where were you living? 20 A I was living with Kay. 21 Q Okay. Then let's turn to page 60 on your -- 22 260 on your deposition, line 13 to 16. 23 "Question: Where were you living at the time 24 that you brought your mother to the hospital on 25 September 15th, 1999? 1987 1 "Answer: I was living in a hotel." 2 A Yes. 3 Q Do you see that? 4 A Yes. 5 Q Did I read that correctly? 6 A Yes, you did. 7 MR. OSBORNE: She needs to publish the next 8 question and answer to put that in context. 9 THE COURT: Go ahead, Ms. Marshall. 10 MS. MARSHALL: Okay. 11 "Question: Okay. You were living in a hotel 12 and your mother was living with your girlfriend? 13 "Answer: No, no, no. I was with my mother in 14 a hotel. That's right. I had left my -- I was 15 living at my girlfriend's house, and then -- that's 16 correct. And then for approximately a week, I had 17 left my girlfriend's house, and I went with my 18 mother to a hotel." 19 THE WITNESS: Correct. 20 BY MS. MARSHALL: 21 Q So basically you've testified to it both ways 22 in your deposition. First, you said that you were at her 23 house, living at Kay's, then you changed that and said 24 you were at a hotel, correct? 25 A Would you allow me to explain? 1988 1 Q I want you to answer my question first. 2 A Correct. And can I explain that? 3 Q Okay. Everybody gets a little mixed up in 4 their depositions with some of these facts that aren't 5 real significant, don't they? 6 A I wasn't -- yes, but I wasn't mixed up. 7 Q Okay. 8 A Would you like me to explain? 9 Q No, thank you. You can do that when your 10 attorney's asking you questions. 11 Now, I want to -- these are out of the Florida 12 Hospital records, and I'll just -- you've reviewed all of 13 those records, have you not? You've reviewed all the 14 Florida Hospital records and all the Sunbelt records? 15 A I think I might know them by heart. 16 Q Okay. And this is the admission note, 17 admission statement. Do you recall seeing that? 18 A Yes, I think so. 19 Q And on the last page, that one's signed by 20 John Steely and John Fleming, correct? 21 A Yes. 22 Q And on this admission note, it states that 23 while -- that this morning, while he was helping her into 24 the shower, she became acutely limp and had a blank stare 25 on her face and began to drool. 1989 1 Do you agree that that is what prompted you to 2 take your mother to Florida Hospital? 3 A I think I had testified that she became limp 4 and she started to drool. 5 Q Was she in the shower? Were you helping her 6 in the shower when she did that? 7 A No. I recall helping her off the bed. She 8 was -- I was trying to help her off something, whether it 9 was a chair or a bed or I don't know what we were trying 10 to do. 11 Q So do you believe that this statement in here 12 about that you were helping her into the shower, that 13 that's an intentionally false statement or an 14 unintentional mistake? 15 A Ma'am, any statement that has nothing to do 16 with me molesting my mother, I'll let you have at it. If 17 you want to say it was intentional or it wasn't, you 18 could have it either way. I'll agree with you. If you 19 want to say I lied about it, say it, but you're not going 20 to sit here and say -- I'd like to get to the point about 21 molesting my mother. 22 MS. MARSHALL: Your Honor, may I request that 23 you direct the witness to answer the question? 24 THE COURT: Counsel, approach the bench. 25 (Bench conference.) 1990 1 THE COURT: I want to warn you your client 2 doesn't get to play by his rules, and I'm resisting 3 slapping him down over that. If you would like to 4 take a minute with him -- 5 MR. OSBORNE: I would very much like to take 6 him outside and talk to him. 7 THE COURT: The next time he marks off like 8 that, I'll give it to him right between the eyes 9 right in front of the jury, and he needs to 10 understand that. 11 (Open court.) 12 THE COURT: Ladies and gentlemen, I'd like to 13 take just a very brief recess of two or three 14 minutes, if you'd step back into the jury room. I'm 15 going to take a break myself. 16 THE COURT DEPUTY: All rise for the jury. 17 THE COURT: The Court will be in brief recess. 18 (Jury exits.) 19 MS. MARSHALL: Your Honor, before we go, may I 20 address the Court? Mr. Destefano just apologized to 21 the jury while they were leaving. 22 THE WITNESS: That's not true. 23 MS. MARSHALL: I think that is totally 24 improper. I don't think that it was picked up on 25 the record, but my partner, Dyana Petro, saw him. 1991 1 THE WITNESS: I didn't apologize to the jury. 2 THE COURT: Mr. Destefano, listen, I'm going 3 to take a break here. I'll just make this simple. 4 I don't know that there's really any way to resolve 5 that. Are you looking for some kind of admonition 6 to the jury or some kind of curative instruction 7 over that? 8 MS. MARSHALL: Your Honor, I would like -- 9 what I'm requesting is for you to direct the witness 10 that it's improper to speak to the jury like that 11 and to ask the jury, yes, to disregard that, that it 12 was inappropriate. 13 THE COURT: I don't have any intention of 14 addressing the jury about -- about this matter. I 15 trust Mr. Osborne is going to convey to his client 16 the seriousness of my warning to him at the sidebar, 17 which I will underscore will be meted out at the 18 very next sign. And I think you know exactly what 19 I'm talking about, Mr. Osborne. And I don't intend 20 to address his client directly on that. He's 21 responsible here, and he understands exactly what 22 the Court is thinking, and I will follow through. 23 We'll be in brief recess. 24 MS. MARSHALL: Thank you, Your Honor. 25 (A 9-minute recess was had.) 1992 1 (Continued to Volume XVI) 2 C E R T I F I C A T E 3 STATE OF FLORIDA) 4 COUNTY OF ORANGE) 5 I, LAURA J. LANDERMAN, R.M.R., C.R.R., certify that 6 I was authorized to and did stenographically report the 7 foregoing proceedings and that the transcript is a true 8 and accurate record. 9 Dated this 16th day of June, 2006. 10 11 12 ___________________________________ 13 LAURA J. LANDERMAN, R.M.R., C.R.R. 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25